Digest Archives Vol 1 Issue 108

From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org 
Sent: Saturday, December 26, 1998 11:17 AM 
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org 
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #108 
 
 
champ-l-digest       Saturday, December 26 1998       Volume 01 : Number 108 
 
 
 
In this issue: 
 
    Re: A Christmas Carol 
    Re: House Rule: Please Comment 
    Re: [APBA:17627] A Christmas Carol 
    Re: Zero phase actions 
    Let's do the time warp... again? 
    Re: House Rule: Please Comment 
    Re: House Rule: Please Comment 
    RE: Let's do the time warp... again? 
    Merry Christmas 
    [none] 
    Re: House Rule: Please Comment 
    Re: Zero phase actions 
    Re: Advantages on STR (was Zero phase actions) 
    Re: Let's do the time warp... again? 
    RE: House Rule: Please Comment 
    Re: Fwd:  The Twelve Days of Chri... 
    CHAR: Anita Carstairs (was Stupid Precog Tricks) 
    GENKI (The Dark Devil) 
    Re: Zero phase actions 
    Re: Zero phase actions 
 
---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
 
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 09:37:08 -0500 
From: Mike Christodoulou <Cypriot@concentric.net> 
Subject: Re: A Christmas Carol 
 
Fellow Listers, 
 
I don't mind off-topic posts.  I really don't.  I can choose to  
read them or not, as my mood hits me. 
 
However, since there seem to be more and more of them lately, 
would the poster please be so kind as to at least indicate 
"OFF-TOPIC" in the header? 
 
 
 
======================  ================================================= 
Mike Christodoulou      "Never doubt that a small group of committed  
Cypriot@Concentric.Net   citizens can change the world.  In fact, it is  
(770) 662-5605           the only thing that ever has."  -- Margaret Mead 
======================  ================================================= 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 22:49:52 -0500 (EST) 
From: "Daniel P. Pawtowski" <dpawtows@acm.vt.edu> 
Subject: Re: House Rule: Please Comment 
 
>  
> Mind Control, as it is now, is much more of an "all or nothing" 
> approach than it is in almost all examples in the literature. In 
> almost all cases in the literature where the "Mind Control" can be 
> resisted, there exist delays, slowdowns, moments of hesitation which 
 
   Well then- it would seem that the various other examples of Mind 
Controll are all "less useful" than the Hero version.  So I suppose 
one could handle this by suitable Limitations: "Target's body obeys, 
but can speak normally", or "Target can make Ego rolls to resist  
whenever the command is against a Psych Lim", or other variations.  
One could define the amount of 'resistance' they make by how much 
they make the Ego roll. 
  i.e, Megaguy can't make a breakout roll for 5 more hours, but when  
ordered to kill his grandmother, he makes an Ego Roll by 3, and then, 
say, uses that to put a -3 on his own OCV to hit. 
 
 
                         Daniel Pawtowski 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 09:12:03 -0800 
From: Michael Robinson <bravefan@bellatlantic.net> 
Subject: Re: [APBA:17627] A Christmas Carol 
 
Glen Sprigg wrote: 
>  
 
 
 
     Calm Down Glenn, lol, try furby.com or ebay 
 
 
                             Mike Robinson 
 
 
> To be sung to the tune of 'The First Noel.' 
>  
> The worst Noel, 
> For one such as myself, 
> Comes from searching for Furbys 
> On empty store shelves. 
>  
> And despite all the gifts 
> Sitting under the tree, 
> The kids will be screaming 
> That "Santa hates me!" 
>  
> Oh hell, oh hell, oh hell, oh hell! 
> "Shopping for Christmas is rotten!" I yell. 
>  
> The stress builds up, 
> My neck cords get thick. 
> And the price of new software 
> Is making me sick. 
>  
> My credit cards are maxed, 
> my back's getting sore, 
> The parking lot's jammed; 
> I can't take this no more! 
>  
> Oh hell, oh hell, oh hell, oh hell! 
> "Shopping for Christmas is murder!" I yell. 
>  
> ******************* 
>  
> To those who might care, a Christmas Carol of my own creation (not a 
> satirical one) will be performed for the first time at the Christmas Eve 
> mass at my church.  I'm excited about this, as I'll be playing it live in 
> front of a pretty big congregation. 
>  
> And to everyone, I would just like to add the following: 
>  
> Forget about 'Season's Greetings;' Merry Christmas, everyone, and God bless! 
>  
> Glen 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 11:28:41 -0800 (PST) 
From: Dale Ward <daleaward@rocketmail.com> 
Subject: Re: Zero phase actions 
 
Greetings! 
 
- ---Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> wrote: 
> >      This brings up an interesting question (at least, to MY mind). 
> > 
> >      How do you figure the cost of an advantage to a characteristic that you 
> >have not increased over the base (i.e. FREE) points? 
> >      For instance, in the above example, if the desolid character only had 
> >his original base STR of 10, how much would it cost to add Affects Solid 
> World? 
>  
>    Any advantage to STR (or any other Characteristic) should be based on 
> its total value.  Thus, Affects Solid World (again, that's a +2 Advantage, 
> not +1) on 10 STR would cost 20 points. 
 
     Since both Bob and Wayne Shaw came up with the same answer, this reply is 
to both. 
 
     While I can see what you're saying, I have to disagree with the 
interpretation. I *DO* agree that the advantage should cost SOMETHING, but you 
can't compute the TOTAL cost from the cost of the STR because the STR cost you 
nothing! Zero times anything is still Zero. 
 
     This has been a thorn in my side about HSR for years, and the ONLY reason 
I even CONSIDERED using Fuzion (modifiers in Fuzion are simply added to the 
base cost of what they modify). Unfortunately, IMO Fuzion has far more 
problems than HSR, so I stick with the tiger I know rather than the one I fear. 
 
     I want to apologize to the list for taking this thread so far off it's 
original track. 
 
Dale A. Ward 
 
_________________________________________________________ 
DO YOU YAHOO!? 
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 11:36:20 -0800 (PST) 
From: Dale Ward <daleaward@rocketmail.com> 
Subject: Let's do the time warp... again? 
 
Greetings! 
 
     I suppose I should just grin and nod and pretend nothing has happened... 
but it's driving me crazy and I have to know. 
 
     Why is it that my mail server shows (only for THIS list) replies to 
messages that are dated before the message to which they are replying?!?!? 
 
     Is this list in a closed time loop or are some of it's members merely 
psychic? 
 
     Or... 
 
     Have I finally gone 'round the bend? 
 
Dale A. Ward 
(looking for the nearest Tardis) 
 
_________________________________________________________ 
DO YOU YAHOO!? 
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 09:34:50 EST 
From: ErolB1@aol.com 
Subject: Re: House Rule: Please Comment 
 
In a message dated 98-12-21 20:57:11 EST, voxel@theramp.net writes: 
 
> There isn't really a need for this kind of micromanagement to be added to 
>  the rules; all such considerations should already be factored in when the 
GM 
>  determines the initial difficulty for the Mind Control. In other words, 
>  don't say "Oh, gee, this character has a Code v. Killing, that'll require 
>  another 15 points of effect"; rather, say "This character has a code v. 
>  killing, so I can assume out of hand that he's going to be 'violently 
>  opposed' to this action". 
 
OTOH, it doesn't sit well with some people (including me) to not have a 
distinction between being 'violently opposed' and '*really* violently 
opposed.' Should it really be no harder to mind control Superman into killing 
Lois Lane than to mind control him into killing a random bank robber? 
 
I don't care for micromanagement either, but I could see extending the chart:  
 
+30 Violently Opposed 
+40 Violently Opposed Two Different Ways 
+50 Violently Opposed Three Different Ways 
 
Erol K. Bayburt 
Evil Genius for a Better Tomorrow 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1998 04:41:31 -0600 
From: "Michael" <mlnunn@scrtc.blue.net> 
Subject: Re: House Rule: Please Comment 
 
>OTOH, it doesn't sit well with some people (including me) to not have a 
>distinction between being 'violently opposed' and '*really* violently 
>opposed.' Should it really be no harder to mind control Superman into 
killing Lois Lane than to mind control him into killing a random bank 
robber? 
> 
>I don't care for micromanagement either, but I could see extending the 
chart: 
 
 
In a sense it already is, if you consider the other Psych Lims, figure in. 
In the above example.  Supes would be Violently Opposed to killing a Bank 
Robber +30.  (20 pt code vs killing) 
He is in love with Lois,(his DNPC) so it would gain a +10. 
If he has protective of friends as a 20 pointer, he could have another +10, 
or maybe even 20. 
That would cover making it harder to control him into killing Lois. 
 
Michael 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1998 04:08:27 -0800 
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net> 
Subject: RE: Let's do the time warp... again? 
 
From: Dale Ward 
>  
>  
> Greetings! 
>  
>      I suppose I should just grin and nod and pretend  
> nothing has happened... 
> but it's driving me crazy and I have to know. 
>  
>      Why is it that my mail server shows (only for THIS  
> list) replies to 
> messages that are dated before the message to which they  
> are replying?!?!? 
 
Its a side effect of how some mail software handles time zones. 
 
Filksinger 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1998 04:08:33 -0800 
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net> 
Subject: Merry Christmas 
 
As the resident filksinger, I've decided to properly wish you all a 
Merry Christmas. Enjoy! 
 
************** 
Major Holidays 
Gary McGath, Copyright 1998 
TTTO "I Am the Very Model of a Modern Major General" by Arthur 
Sullivan 
 
A Merry Christmas, happy Chanukah, and joyous Holiday, 
Sweet Solstice, cozy Kwanzaa, and right Ramadan for Allah day, 
And happy birthday, Isaac Newton, likewise for Beethoven too, 
In concert hall or church or mosque or synagogue or coven too. 
Ta Chiu, God bless you merry gentlemen who follow Zen and Tao, 
And Pasko in the Philippines, and King's Birthday in Thailand now. 
Pearl Harbor Day, Midvinterblot, or Wassail night, or day of Yule, 
Or any other good excuse to get you out of work or school. (Repeat 3x) 
 
The Festival of Bonfires, also Ganna for the best of all, 
And in Tibet they say that there's a butter sculpture festival, 
And so, whatever you decide that you would like to call a day, 
We wish to you a happy, joyous, merry winter holiday. 
************** 
 
Merry Christmas 
Joyeuse Noel 
Feliz Navidad 
Mele Kelikimaka 
 
Filksinger 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date:  
From:  
Subject: [none] 
 
 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: 24 Dec 1998 18:33:12 -0500 
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> 
Subject: Re: House Rule: Please Comment 
 
- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- 
Hash: SHA1 
 
"DN" == David Nasset, <davidn@edmark.com> writes: 
 
DN> So, if you used Mind Control on a villain in my campaign and told him 
DN> to attack his allies, and you succeeded, but I declared that he fought 
DN> you for two Turns before acting, you wouldn't object? 
 
I would object on the grounds that he is fighting me insted of dealing with 
the Mind Control. 
 
Time stops.  Everyone watches the dramatic physical manifestation of the 
victim's mental anguish.  Time resumes.  What you are asking for is the 
mechanization of solilloquies. 
 
An important thing to remember is that the victim of Mind Control is 
frequently not a senseless puppet.  Most of the time the victim should 
perform the command in the same way he would if it were his own decision. 
I would expect a sniper given the command "attack your allies" to 
reposition himself appropriately to carry out the order.  If you want a 
puppet, include the +10 'trance state' modifier in your effect roll. 
 
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=kVHw 
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- --  
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>    \ Warning: pregnant women, the elderly, and 
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ children under 10 should avoid prolonged 
GPG Key: same as my PGP 5 (DH) key  \ exposure to Happy Fun Ball. 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: 25 Dec 1998 09:33:59 -0500 
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> 
Subject: Re: Zero phase actions 
 
- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- 
Hash: SHA1 
 
"DW" == Dale Ward <daleaward@rocketmail.com> writes: 
 
DW>      While I can see what you're saying, I have to disagree with the 
DW> interpretation. I *DO* agree that the advantage should cost SOMETHING, 
DW> but you can't compute the TOTAL cost from the cost of the STR because 
DW> the STR cost you nothing! Zero times anything is still Zero. 
 
Your 'free' 10 points of Strength cost you no character points, but it has 
an active cost of 10 points.  If you want to buy Armor Piercing for it, it 
will cost you 5 points: 10 * (1 + 0.5) = 15. 
 
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G7Cs6xFcgAJvi3orQ3xBFno= 
=MHCu 
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- --  
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>    \ Warning: pregnant women, the elderly, and 
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ children under 10 should avoid prolonged 
GPG Key: same as my PGP 5 (DH) key  \ exposure to Happy Fun Ball. 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1998 07:00:41 -0800 
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> 
Subject: Re: Advantages on STR (was Zero phase actions) 
 
At 11:28 AM 12/24/98 -0800, Dale Ward wrote: 
>Greetings! 
> 
>---Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> wrote: 
>> >      This brings up an interesting question (at least, to MY mind). 
>> > 
>> >      How do you figure the cost of an advantage to a characteristic 
that you 
>> >have not increased over the base (i.e. FREE) points? 
>> >      For instance, in the above example, if the desolid character only 
had 
>> >his original base STR of 10, how much would it cost to add Affects Solid 
>> World? 
>>  
>>    Any advantage to STR (or any other Characteristic) should be based on 
>> its total value.  Thus, Affects Solid World (again, that's a +2 Advantage, 
>> not +1) on 10 STR would cost 20 points. 
> 
>     Since both Bob and Wayne Shaw came up with the same answer, this 
reply is 
>to both. 
> 
>     While I can see what you're saying, I have to disagree with the 
>interpretation. I *DO* agree that the advantage should cost SOMETHING, but 
you 
>can't compute the TOTAL cost from the cost of the STR because the STR cost 
you 
>nothing! Zero times anything is still Zero. 
 
   This is precisely the reason that you don't use the total *cost* when 
computing an Advantage to STR; you use the total *value* -- IOW, what it 
would cost if you had to buy it up from Zero.  That's why a +2 Advantage on 
10 STR would cost 20 points (the value I give above, which you apparently 
missed). 
- --- 
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page!  [Circle of HEROS member] 
   http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm 
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join? 
   http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1998 17:26:16 -0500 
From: geoff heald <gheald@worldnet.att.net> 
Subject: Re: Let's do the time warp... again? 
 
At 11:36 AM 12/24/98 -0800, you wrote: 
>Greetings! 
> 
>     I suppose I should just grin and nod and pretend nothing has happened... 
>but it's driving me crazy and I have to know. 
> 
>     Why is it that my mail server shows (only for THIS list) replies to 
>messages that are dated before the message to which they are replying?!?!? 
> 
 
Quick guess: not everyone has the correct time on their computer.  On 
another list I'm on, there's a guy in Japan who's mailserver is in Hawaii. 
So his messages should be stamped +0930, but instead they show -0800.  But 
the time on the message comes off his computer, so it shows that it was 
sent about 18 hours from now from Hawaii. 
 
>     Is this list in a closed time loop or are some of it's members merely 
>psychic? 
> 
Or it could be one of those AOL things. 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1998 15:11:51 -0800 
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net> 
Subject: RE: House Rule: Please Comment 
 
From: Stainless Steel Rat 
> 
> 
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- 
> Hash: SHA1 
> 
> "DN" == David Nasset, <davidn@edmark.com> writes: 
> 
> DN> So, if you used Mind Control on a villain in my 
> campaign and told him 
> DN> to attack his allies, and you succeeded, but I declared 
> that he fought 
> DN> you for two Turns before acting, you wouldn't object? 
> 
> I would object on the grounds that he is fighting me insted 
> of dealing with 
> the Mind Control. 
> 
> Time stops.  Everyone watches the dramatic physical 
> manifestation of the 
> victim's mental anguish.  Time resumes.  What you are 
> asking for is the 
> mechanization of solilloquies. 
 
No, I am not. I do not believe that you understand what I am saying. 
 
These pauses and effects, which are common in almost all genre's with 
Mind Control, actually have significant effects upon combat. I am not 
talking about soliloquies, I'm talking about people who are given 
commands to harm their allies, but who resist continuously, and thus 
slow their own actions enough to create delays, minuses to their own 
OCV, or reduce their movement sufficient to allow their allies to stop 
or escape them. 
 
> An important thing to remember is that the victim of Mind Control is 
> frequently not a senseless puppet.  Most of the time the 
> victim should 
> perform the command in the same way he would if it were his 
> own decision. 
 
Which is exactly my point. They don't hesitate needlessly, move very 
slowly, or pull their punches or throw them off by resisting. These 
are all non-existent in HERO, but common in stories involving Mind 
Control. 
 
> I would expect a sniper given the command "attack your allies" to 
> reposition himself appropriately to carry out the order. 
> If you want a 
> puppet, include the +10 'trance state' modifier in your effect roll. 
 
I don't want a "puppet". In fact, the "puppet" would be even _worse_ 
from my point of view. I want Mind Control to allow for people who are 
controlled enough to force them to perform actions, but who, due to 
their resistance, perform poorly. They hesitate long enough to have a 
significant effect upon combat. They move slowly when chasing people 
to kill them. They slow their actions sufficiently to give themselves 
a lower OCV and/or DCV. Furthermore, since it fits so well with 
virtually all genres featuring Mind Control, I want some variation on 
this to be the default. 
 
Under the present system, he can say, "Run away, I'm trying to kill 
you!" as much as he wants, or do a soliloquy-like hesitation, but he 
follows the command as well as if it was his own idea. Significant 
combat effects of resistance to Mind Control don't exist, except for 
throwing off its effects entirely. This is the "all-or-nothing" effect 
to which many have referred. Personally, I'd rather have more detail. 
 
One possibility, which would also address the concerns of those who 
claim that Mind Control isn't effective enough, is to make the targets 
hesitate longer and move more slowly or clumsily if they make their 
EGO rolls, but not escape entirely unless they roll particularly well. 
This makes Mind Control more effective while allowing for the kind of 
'partial resistance' that I would like to see. 
 
Filksinger 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1998 21:04:57 -0500 
From: "Robert A. West" <robtwest@erols.com> 
Subject: Re: Fwd:  The Twelve Days of Chri... 
 
Tim Statler wrote: 
 
> > The Twelve Days of Christmas 
> > 
> > December 14, 
> > December 15,  
* * *  
> > December 25 
 
Whoops! Not to be a joke-pooper (especially with all those birds already 
doing it all over poor Jenny's house), but the Twelve Days of Christmas 
are the twelve days *after* Christmas (December 25) until Ephiphany 
(January 6).  Traditionally, Christmas decorations were left up through 
Twelfth Night (Jan 5, the eve of Twelfth Day, or Epiphany), and 
wassailing, caroling and gift-giving continued during this whole period. 
In some districts in medieval times, the holiday festivities carried on 
through Candlemas Eve (February 1)!  After a forty-day party, I suppose 
that Lent was a welcome break. 
 
By the way, the tradition of keeping decorations up through Twelfth 
Night causes no end of irritation when public decorations are taken down 
and municipal tree collections are scheduled before January 6.  Of 
course, this same tradition involves decorating the Christmas tree on 
Christmas Eve, or on the day of the Solstice, or on the fourth Sunday of 
Advent, not in late November!  In fact, it was regarded as ill luck to 
bring holly indoors before the 24th of December. 
 
Many of the twelve days have their own names and feasts, which are 
memorialized in carols which are still sung by people who are ignorant 
of their original purpose.  Thus, December 26 is the Feast of the 
Innocents, and is memorialized in the old carol: 
 
	Refrain: 
	Bye-bye, lullay, thou little tiny child, 
	Bye-bye, lully, lullay. 
	Thou little tiny child, bye-bye lully, lullay! 
	Verse: 
	Oh, sisters too, how may we do, 
	For to preserve this day, 
	This poor youngling, for whom we do sing 
	Bye-bye lully, lullay? 
	(Refrain) 
	Verse: 
	Herod the King, in his raging, 
	Charged he hath this day, 
	His men of might, in his own sight 
	All young children to slay! 
	(Refrain) 
	Verse: 
	Then woe is me!  Poor child for thee! 
	And ever morn and day, 
	For thy parting, nay say nor sing, 
	Bye-bye lully, lullay. 
 
December 27 is the feast of St. Stephen, which is referred to in the 
modern carol: 
 
	Good King Wenceslas looked out,  
	On the Feast of Stephen, 
	When the snow lay round about,  
	Deep and crisp and even. 
	Brightly shone the moon that night,  
	Though the frost was cruel, 
	When a poor man came in sight,  
	Gathering winter fuel. 
 
	"Hither, page, and stand by me! 
	If thou knowest, telling, 
	Yonder peasant, who is he? 
	Where and what his dwelling?" 
	"Sire, he lives a good league hence, 
	Underneath the mountain, 
	Right against the forest-fence, 
	By St. Agnes' fountain." 
 
	"Bring me flesh, and bring me wine. 
	Bring me pine logs hither! 
	Thou and I will see him dine, 
	When we bear them thither!" 
	Page and monarch forth they went, 
	Forth they went together, 
	Through the rude winds' wild lament, 
	And the bitter weather. 
 
	"Sire!  The night grows darker now, 
	And the wind grows stronger. 
	Fails my heart.  I know not how 
	I can go on longer!" 
	"Mark my footsteps, good my page, 
	Treadst thou in them boldly. 
	Thou wilt find the winter's rage, 
	Freeze thy blood less coldly!" 
 
	In his master's steps he trod, 
	Where the snow lay dinted. 
	Heat was in the very sod, 
	Which the saint had printed. 
	Therefore Christian men be sure, 
	Wealth or rank possessing. 
	He who now will bless the poor, 
	Shall himself find blessing. 
 
Of course, January 6 is a dual celebration.  As Epiphany is marks the 
baptism of Jesus by John.  As Twelfth Day, it celebrates the visit of 
the Wise Men to the baby Jesus, bearing gold and frankincense and myrrh. 
Tradition has given them names and made them kings: 
 
	Verse: (all) 
	We three kings of Orient are, 
	Bearing gifts we traverse afar, 
	Field and fountain, moor and mountain, 
	Following yonder star. 
	Refrain: 
	Oh! Star of wonder, star of night! 
	Star with royal beauty bright! 
	Westward leading, still proceding, 
	Guide us to thy perfect light! 
	Verse: (Melchior) 
	Born a king on Bethlehem's plane, 
	Gold I bring to crown him again! 
	King forever, ceasing never 
	Over us all to reign. 
	(Refrain) 
	Verse: (Balthazzar) 
	Frankincense to offer have I, 
	Incense owns a deity nigh. 
	Prayer and praising, all men raising, 
	Worship him, God most high! 
	(Refrain) 
	Verse: (Caspar) 
	Myrrh is mine, it's bitter perfume, 
	Breathes a life of gathering gloom. 
	Sorrowing, sighing, bleeding, dying, 
	Sealed in the stone-cold tomb. 
	(Refrain) 
	Verse: (all) 
	Glorious now behold him arise! 
	King and God and Sacrifice! 
	Alleluia!  Alleluia! 
	Earth to Heaven replies. 
	(Refrain) 
 
Anyway, have a Merry Christmas, and a merry Twelve Days, too!  As for 
the New Year, may your days be filled with enough gold for your needs, 
may no one be frankly incensed with you, and may you have every reason 
to be Myrrh-y! 
 
Robert A. West 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1998 23:16:34 EST 
From: llwatts@juno.com (Leah L Watts) 
Subject: CHAR: Anita Carstairs (was Stupid Precog Tricks) 
 
A while back, I asked for ideas for a precog character.  Here's a draft 
of the character, if anyone has feedback. 
 
I deliberately chose to write her as a heroic-level character -- I've got 
an idea for a Champs game (probably set in San Angelo) where all the 
characters would be LPMs, and wanted to see how the point levels would 
work out.  Other notes are at the end of the post. 
 
Leah 
 
- ---------------- 
Anita Carstairs 
 
Characteristics: 
 
Value   Stat    Cost 
10	STR	0 
14	DEX	12 
13	CON	6 
10	BODY	0 
13	INT	3 
13	EGO	6 
15	PRE	5 
14	COM	2 
4	PD	2 
3	ED	0 
3	SPD	6 
5	REC	0 
26	END	0 
25	STUN	3 
 
Characteristics Cost: 45 
 
Skills/Powers: 
 
     Precognitive Abilities: 
 
18	Precognitive Clairsentience, Normal Sight &  
	 Hearing, 9- Activation				(4 END) 
10	2 Combat Skill Levels: DCV only 
5	+15 PRE, Defensive Only, Only for foreseen  
	 events 
10	11- Danger Sense (in combat) 
 
     Combat Skills: 
 
20	Martial Art -- Aikido 
(5)	Redirect 
(4)	Martial Dodge 
(4)	Joint Lock/Throw 
(4)	Martial Escape 
(3)	KS: Aikido 12- (INT based) 
3	Breakfall 12- 
5	Defense Maneuver 
 
     Professional/Background Skills: 
 
4	KS: photography 13- (INT based) 
4	PS: Photographer 13- (INT based) 
3	Concealment 12- 
3	Conversation 12- 
3	Combat Driving (cars) 12- 
3	Computer Programming 12- 
1	Fam.: Electronics 8- 
3	High Society 12- 
3 	Paramedic 12- 
3	Persuasion 12- 
3	AK: campaign city 12- 
1	TF: cars 
 
 
Powers Cost: 105 
Total Cost: 150 
 
Base Points: 75 
 
15	DNPC, normal, useful skills, appear 14- (random DNPC) 
5	Professional Rivalry (another photographer) 
       	Psych Limitations: 
10	  Afraid to tell others about her visions (uncommon, strong) 
15	  Wants to help people (common, strong) 
10	Distinctive Feature: Style Disadvantage 
10	Susceptability: 2d6 STUN from precognitive visions 
	  (instant effect, uncommon) 
10	Hunted: street gang, 8- (more powerful, limited area) 
 
Disadvantages Total: 75 
Experience Spent: 0 
Total Points: 150 
 
- ----- 
Background: 
 
Anita Carstairs had always had vivid dreams, but there was something 
different about the one that woke her during the summer she turned 9.  
She knew somehow that it wasn't just a nightmare.  Then, two weeks later, 
her parents were getting ready to drive into town, and Anita realized her 
dream was being played out in real life.  She tried her best, but she 
couldn't persuade her parents to wait.  Anita watched them start down the 
street, and then watched a drunk driver veer across the median and hit 
their car, which exploded -- just like in her dream. 
 
After the funerals, Anita went to live with her grandparents.  She didn't 
have much trouble adjusting to a new school, but dealing with her 
parents' deaths was harder.  Unfortunately, the psychiatrist she was sent 
to knew almost nothing about paranormal abilities.  He refused to believe 
that she could have foreseen the accident, instead insisting that she was 
making it up to get attention.  After 6 months of this, Anita's family 
switched doctors, but the damage was done.  Anita eventually recovered 
from her grief, but was convinced that telling others about her dreams 
was bad. 
 
As she grew up, Anita had other dreams that came true.  She was afraid to 
tell anyone about them, but learned (after a dream of a diving accident) 
that if she could manage to be at the site of a vision when it occured, 
she could help.  She didn't seem to panic as badly as others, since it 
wasn't a surprise to her. 
 
When she was 16, she went to a demo sponsored by a local martial arts 
school, and became interested in aikido.  Her instructor never said 
anything to indicate that he knew of her visions, but he recommended she 
practice several meditation techniques.  Shortly after Anita began 
meditating, she discovered that she could occasionally call up visions of 
the future while awake. 
 
After high school, Anita went to the local community college and studied 
photography.  She set up her own studio after graduation, and has 
photographed several debutante balls and society weddings.  Society work 
may pay the bills, but Anita has gotten much more enjoyment through 
helping people.  Her precognitive visions are too undependable for her to 
take up full-time adventuring, but if she ever gains full control over 
her visions that could change. 
 
Appearance: 
 
Anita is 5'6", 145 pounds.  She has wavy black hair, normally 
shoulder-length, pale skin, and blue eyes.  Given any choice in the 
matter, she dresses casually, but if working outside her studio she will 
wear whatever lets her fit in -- from a Mickey Mouse hat while taking 
kindergarten class pictures to formal dresses when photographing a 
wedding. 
 
Notes: 
 
Her powers are fairly simple.  The Danger Sense, Defense Maneuver and DCV 
levels reflect her reactions to subconscious readings of the immediate 
future.  The defensive PRE simulates the fact that she can prepare 
mentally to deal with the situation she has foreseen. 
 
(As was hinted at in the background, she still gets "spontaneous" visions 
of the future.  I suppose I could have bought Precog twice, once NCC for 
GM option visions and once with the Activation Roll for her 
sorta-controlled visions, but why?  Just tell the GM he's got permission 
to use her Precog as a plot device, a la Justice Inc.) 
 
On her disads:  Anita has a strong tendency to get overprotective of the 
people she's helping.  Hidden in her subconscious, there's still the 
little girl who thinks she should have been able to save her parents, and 
she's still trying to make up for their deaths.  This could be modified 
with therapy, but first Anita would have to realize that she's doing it. 
 
A street gang wants revenge -- Anita rescued the target of a carjacking, 
and three gang members went to jail in the aftermath.  Fortunately for 
her, the gang would have to violate other gangs' territories in order to 
search the whole city, and they're not strong enough for that. 
 
Anita turned down a job offer from an established photography studio in 
order to start her own.  That studio's owner took offense, and has tried 
several times to get Anita's clients away from her. 
 
Finally, there is some physical shock associated with her visions, most 
likely because Anita does not have control over the power. 
 
___________________________________________________________________ 
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Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html 
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------------------------------ 
 
Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1998 22:45:08 -0600 
From: "Logan Darklighter" <logand@cyberramp.net> 
Subject: GENKI (The Dark Devil) 
 
This is my first outright posting to this group. So please be gentle. 
^_^;;;; 
 
 
Mecha Conversion 
 
 
GENKI (Translation: The Dark Devil) 
 
Val    Char    Cost    Roll    Notes 
45     STR      15        16-    12.5 Tons 
14     Body     ---        12- 
4       SIZE     20 
16     DEF     42 
23     DEX     39        14-    OCV: 8 / DCV: 6 
4       SPD      7                    PHASES: 3, 6, 9, 12 
 
Total Characteristics Cost: 123 
 
Movement: Ground: 20" / 40" Superleap: 28" / 56" 
 
Powers:___________________________________________________________________ 
 
Twin Pumped Lasers: (OIF, Bulky -1) 
            4d6 RKA 
                    Penetrating (+1/2), 
                    No Range Penalty (+1/2), 
                    Increased Max Range x5 (+1/4), 
                    0 End (+1/2), 
                    60 Degree Arc (-1/2) (66) 
 
20MM Vulcan Cannon: (OIF,Bulky -1) 
            3d6 RKA 
                   Autofire x10 (+3/4), 
                   60 Charges (+1/2), 
                   180 Degree Arc (-1/4) (45) 
 
Multi-Missile Launcher (OIF, Bulky -1) 
        10d6 EB 
                Autofire x5 (+1/2), 
                Explosion (+1/2), 
                Indirect (+1/4), 
                30 Charges (+1/4) (62) 
 
(Note: The Indirect Advantage is not for "phasing through walls" or 
anything so esoteric, it is simply there to simulate the  fact that the 
missiles can be targeted as indirect fire. They can be fired "over the 
horizon" over or around buildings and  corners.) 
 
 
Legs: (OIF, Bulky -1) 
        +14" Ground Movement (20" Total) (14) 
        Shrinking, 2 Lvls, 
                Only for Folding legs to 
                Fit 2.5 x 2.5 meter Spaces (-1), 
                0 End (+1/2) (10) 
 
Jump Jets: (OIF, Bulky -1) 
        20" Superleap (5) 
 
 
Leg Spikes: (OIF, Bulky -1) 
        Clinging 45 STR (5) 
 
 
Communications: (OIF, Bulky -1) 
        High-Range Radio Hearing and Transmit (5) 
 
 
Optics: (OIF, Bulky -1) 
        Infra-Red Vision (2) 
        Ultra-Violet Vision (2) 
        +6 Telescopic (4) 
        Flash Defense -12 (6) 
 
 
Sealed Environment: (OIF, Bulky -1) 
        Life Support, Self Contained Breathing, 
                5 Hour Limit, (-1/4) (4) 
        Life Support, Safe in Vacuum/High Pressure, 
                Radiation, Extreme Heat/Cold (4) 
 
 
Wire Tentacles: (OIF, Bulky -1) 
        Extra Limbs x2 (2) 
        4" Stretching, Only on Wire Tentacles (-1/2), 0 End (+1/2) (12) 
 
 
Operator Neurolink System: (OIF, Bulky -1) 
        Elemental Control (3) 
                  a - +5 DEX, doesn't add to figured (-1/2) (3) 
                  b - +1 SPD, doesn't add to figured (-1/2) (3) 
                  c - +3 Lvls w/ ATAV Weapons (4) 
 
NOTE: I'm not sure if the above EC should have the Advantage: Usable By 
Others or not. At first glance it seems that the operators of the vehicle 
would have the advantage of whatever the vehicle provides by default. But 
you may disagree. In any case, the only reason for the above would be to 
match the Pilot and Gunner reaction times to that of the mech listed in the 
basic stats. As always, if you feel it's abusive, remove it. 
 
 
 
 
Total Powers Cost: 261 
 
 
 
Disads 
        Susceptability: 
                1d6 DEX Drain Per Segment in 
                 intense Magnetic Fields (20) 
        Distinctive Features: 
                Four-legged Mecha: Not concealable, Extreme (25) 
        Watched: 
                Hou Bang, Mo. Pow. NCI (15) 
        Physical Limitation: 
                Incredibly Complex to Maintain and Repair (20) 
                Requires Special Training to Operate, 
                All the time, Slight, (15) 
                Requires Two Operators for full capabilities, All the Time, 
Greatly (20) 
        Reputation: 
                Mysterious Killing machine, Extreme Rep, 14- (20) 
 
Total Cost: 384 
Total Disadvantages: 150 
Base: 249 
Cost To Hou Bang: 50 (Divided into 25 Points apiece for the two Operators) 
 
 
 
Creation Notes: This is my Hero System version of one of the coolest mecha 
I've ever seen. The Genki (Dark Devil) from Bubblegum Crisis #7 Double 
Vision. The Genki was truly a fearsome machine. Capable of taking on a squad 
of standard BU 55C Combat Boomers and holding it's own. Against anything 
less than a Doberman or giant boomer it was nearly unstoppable. The armor 
proved impervious to the KnightSabers weaponry, and Kou, the standard gunner 
and copilot, acting alone, dealt Priss her first outright defeat in the 
series. 
 
Aside from it's deadly weaponry and thick armor, one of the things that made 
the Genki stand out was it's awesome agility and movement abilities. It 
could leap literally ten times it's own height, cling to any surface it 
could sink it's claws into, fold a segment of it's legs to fit into tight 
spaces and still be able to move at a good clip. 
 
I tried to come up with Disadvantages that seemed to fit what I had seen in 
the show, or were reasonable extrapolations based on my conception of how 
things work. The DEX Drain in Intense Magnetic fields was not shown in the 
show, but seemed to me a reasonable limitation based on the idea that it is 
not moved via hydraulics but via myomer style muscles similar to what 
Boomers use. I figure that much like the M-66 (another anime) the Genki's 
performance might start to degrade if someone activated an EMP field around 
it. 
 
CAUTION!!! 
 
This writeup is _EXTREMELY_ powerful. If you use it in a superhero game, I 
recommend that it be used against heroes who have a _lot_ of experience 
and/or power. I originally designed this with the intent to use it as a 
VIPER mecha. But reconsidered once I had finished. The players weren't 
anywhere _near_ capable of fighting this thing!! Maybe when I get in a game 
where everyone is about 500 points I might reconsider springing this on 
them. 
 
If you want to downpower the Genki for use in your campaign, I recommend 
doing away with the reflex booster, the missiles, reduce the armor from 16 
to a more reasonable 12-13, and reducing the level of the attacks by a die 
or two or removing some of the more obnoxious advantages and limitations. 
 
 
Any feedback would be appreciated, as usual. 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1998 01:22:58 EST 
From: Firelynx16@aol.com 
Subject: Re: Zero phase actions 
 
In a message dated 12/25/98 3:05:51 AM Central Standard Time, 
daleaward@rocketmail.com writes: 
 
> --Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> wrote: 
>  > >      This brings up an interesting question (at least, to MY mind). 
>  > > 
>  > >      How do you figure the cost of an advantage to a characteristic 
that  
> you 
>  > >have not increased over the base (i.e. FREE) points? 
>  > >      For instance, in the above example, if the desolid character only  
> had 
>  > >his original base STR of 10, how much would it cost to add Affects Solid 
>  > World? 
>  >  
>  >    Any advantage to STR (or any other Characteristic) should be based on 
>  > its total value.  Thus, Affects Solid World (again, that's a +2 
Advantage, 
>  > not +1) on 10 STR would cost 20 points. 
>   
>       Since both Bob and Wayne Shaw came up with the same answer, this reply 
> is 
>  to both. 
>   
>       While I can see what you're saying, I have to disagree with the 
>  interpretation. I *DO* agree that the advantage should cost SOMETHING, but  
> you 
>  can't compute the TOTAL cost from the cost of the STR because the STR cost  
> you 
>  nothing! Zero times anything is still Zero. 
>   
 
Whether the base STR costs the character in character points or not is 
irrelevant.  The issue is whether there are *any* character points associated 
with that base STR, and there are.  This is seen very easily when you buy STR, 
or any Characteristic, down.  And it is those same character points associated 
with that base STR that any Advantages are applied to when working costs out. 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1998 10:43:55 EST 
From: ErolB1@aol.com 
Subject: Re: Zero phase actions 
 
In a message dated 98-12-25 04:05:51 EST, daleaward@rocketmail.com writes: 
 
>      While I can see what you're saying, I have to disagree with the 
>  interpretation. I *DO* agree that the advantage should cost SOMETHING, but  
> you 
>  can't compute the TOTAL cost from the cost of the STR because the STR cost  
> you 
>  nothing! Zero times anything is still Zero. 
 
The way I do this sort of thing (in Heromaker) is to buy down 'base' STR to 0 
(getting 10 points back), and then buy 10 STR as a power, with the advantage 
tacked on normally. (10 STR, +2 Affects Solid: 10 pts with a +2 advantage = 30 
pts) 
Overall cost is 20 points, which is the same as the Bob & Wayne method, but 
which I find simpler to understand.  
 
Erol K. Bayburt 
Evil Genius for a Better Tomorrow 
 
------------------------------ 
 
End of champ-l-digest V1 #108 
***************************** 


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