Digest Archives Vol 1 Issue 110

From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org 
Sent: Sunday, December 27, 1998 7:05 PM 
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org 
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #110 
 
 
champ-l-digest        Sunday, December 27 1998        Volume 01 : Number 110 
 
 
 
In this issue: 
 
    Re: GENKI (The Dark Devil) 
    Press Release: COLD FUZION IS RECRUITING WRITERS, ADVERTISERS. 
    Re: Zero phase actions 
    Re: CHAR: Anita Carstairs (was Stupid Precog Tricks) 
    Re: DREAMRIDERS REORGANIZES (attn: John D) 
    Re: Let's do the time warp... again? 
    Re: Selective Senses and Powers/Percise Measurements 
    Re: GENKI (The Dark Devil) 
    Re: GENKI (The Dark Devil) (Long) 
    Re: GENKI (The Dark Devil) (Long) 
    Re: Press Release: COLD FUZION IS RECRUITING WRITERS, ADVERTISERS. 
    Re: Selective Senses and Powers/Percise Measurements 
    Recent crossposting by Dreamriders, et al 
    Re: Press Release: COLD FUZION IS RECRUITING WRITERS, ADVERTISERS. 
    Re: Selective Senses and Powers/Percise Measurements 
    Re: Selective Senses and Powers/Percise Measurements 
    Re: Recent crossposting by Dreamriders, et al 
 
---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 98 20:26:34  
From: "qts" <qts@nildram.co.uk> 
Subject: Re: GENKI (The Dark Devil) 
 
On Fri, 25 Dec 1998 22:45:08 -0600, Logan Darklighter wrote: 
 
>This is my first outright posting to this group. So please be gentle. 
>^_^;;;; 
> 
> 
>Mecha Conversion 
> 
> 
>GENKI (Translation: The Dark Devil) 
> 
>Val    Char    Cost    Roll    Notes 
>45     STR      15        16-    12.5 Tons 
>14     Body     ---        12- 
>4       SIZE     20 
>16     DEF     42 
>23     DEX     39        14-    OCV: 8 / DCV: 6 
>4       SPD      7                    PHASES: 3, 6, 9, 12 
> 
>Total Characteristics Cost: 123 
> 
>Movement: Ground: 20" / 40" Superleap: 28" / 56" 
> 
>Powers:___________________________________________________________________ 
 
<snip> 
 
Shouldn't these be in an EC? And should the Bulky limitation apply, as 
they aren't bulky for a mecha? 
 
<rest snipped> 
 
 
qts 
 
Home: qts@nildram.co.uk. 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 15:24:40 -0500 
From: Opus <opus@sprint.ca> 
Subject: Press Release: COLD FUZION IS RECRUITING WRITERS, ADVERTISERS. 
 
For : Dreamriders Workshop 
Contact : Cory Conrad  
Email : info@dreamriders.com 
Phone : 514-366-9096 
Keywords : Comic Books, Dreamriders Workshop 
 
 
For Immediate Release : COLD FUZION IS RECRUITING WRITERS, ADVERTISERS. 
 
 
Cold Fuzion, the magazine of the Fuzion role-playing game (RPG) system, 
is looking for writers and advertisers. 
 
Debuing in the Spring of 1999, Cold Fuzion will focus on extending and 
enhancing the Fuzion settings which have come before it, the one to come 
after, and those created by players alike. Featuring insider news, 
reviews, articles, and comic serials, Cold Fuzion is poised to become 
the place for a players monthly Fuzion fix. 
 
Dreamriders is looking for writers able to handle the Fuzion system, 
whether writing material for an existing campaign setting, or creating 
something entirely new. Previous experience is not necessary, but strong 
writing skills and knowledge of the system are essential. Payment is 3 
cents a word to start, payable upon publication. 
 
We are also looking for advertisers interested in reaching or target 
market of role-playing game players through Cold Fuzion and Dreamriders' 
Fuzion Powered Comics (a blend of traditional comic books and the Fuzion 
RPG system). Being a focal point of Fuzion interest we will be able to 
deliver  thousands of eyes a month to your ad. If you are an advertiser 
and would like more information on rates, or wish to see a preview of 
what to expect from Cold Fuzion or the Fuzion Powered comics you may 
request it from info@dreamriders.com 
 
On tap for the first few issues, the first full release version of 
Heroic Abilities by Jason A. Dour, a Foxbat adventure by Bruce Harlick, 
a Foxbat comic serial, and Material on Starfire Masterforce by Gary E. 
Townsend and Shaintar by Sean Fannon. 
 
- -*- 
 
For more information on Dreamriders Workshop, contact Cory Conrad at 
info@dreamriders.com, or surf over to the DW website : 
www.dreamriders.com. To no longer receive these press-releases, respond 
to this message with "remove me" as the subject. 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 98 20:47:57  
From: "qts" <qts@nildram.co.uk> 
Subject: Re: Zero phase actions 
 
On Thu, 24 Dec 1998 11:28:41 -0800 (PST), Dale Ward wrote: 
 
>Greetings! 
> 
>---Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> wrote: 
>> >      This brings up an interesting question (at least, to MY mind). 
>> > 
>> >      How do you figure the cost of an advantage to a characteristic that you 
>> >have not increased over the base (i.e. FREE) points? 
>> >      For instance, in the above example, if the desolid character only had 
>> >his original base STR of 10, how much would it cost to add Affects Solid 
>> World? 
>>  
>>    Any advantage to STR (or any other Characteristic) should be based on 
>> its total value.  Thus, Affects Solid World (again, that's a +2 Advantage, 
>> not +1) on 10 STR would cost 20 points. 
> 
>     Since both Bob and Wayne Shaw came up with the same answer, this reply is 
>to both. 
> 
>     While I can see what you're saying, I have to disagree with the 
>interpretation. I *DO* agree that the advantage should cost SOMETHING, but you 
>can't compute the TOTAL cost from the cost of the STR because the STR cost you 
>nothing! Zero times anything is still Zero. 
 
Your basic premise is flawed. That you start with 10 pts in STR doesn't 
mean those points cost nothing - after all, if they did, you couldn't 
get 5 points back by reducing that value of 10 to 5, could you? 
 
The way to look at it is that you are not building a Superhero on 100 + 
150 points (or whatever) but on Base + 100 + 150 points 
 
ARW on a standard 10 STR costs 20 pts. 
qts 
 
Home: qts@nildram.co.uk. 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 98 20:40:04  
From: "qts" <qts@nildram.co.uk> 
Subject: Re: CHAR: Anita Carstairs (was Stupid Precog Tricks) 
 
On Fri, 25 Dec 1998 23:16:34 EST, Leah L Watts wrote: 
 
>A while back, I asked for ideas for a precog character.  Here's a draft 
>of the character, if anyone has feedback. 
> 
>I deliberately chose to write her as a heroic-level character -- I've got 
>an idea for a Champs game (probably set in San Angelo) where all the 
>characters would be LPMs, and wanted to see how the point levels would 
>work out.  Other notes are at the end of the post. 
> 
>Leah 
> 
>---------------- 
>Anita Carstairs 
> 
>Characteristics: 
> 
>Value   Stat    Cost 
>10	STR	0 
>14	DEX	12 
>13	CON	6 
>10	BODY	0 
>13	INT	3 
>13	EGO	6 
>15	PRE	5 
>14	COM	2 
>4	PD	2 
>3	ED	0 
>3	SPD	6 
>5	REC	0 
>26	END	0 
>25	STUN	3 
> 
>Characteristics Cost: 45 
> 
>Skills/Powers: 
> 
>     Precognitive Abilities: 
> 
>18	Precognitive Clairsentience, Normal Sight &  
>	 Hearing, 9- Activation				(4 END) 
 
Why not make this NCC As Well for a -1/4 bonus? 
 
>10	2 Combat Skill Levels: DCV only 
 
DCV Only is a -1 Limitation, so this is 5 pts. 
 
>5	+15 PRE, Defensive Only, Only for foreseen  
>	 events 
>10	11- Danger Sense (in combat) 
> 
>     Combat Skills: 
> 
>20	Martial Art -- Aikido 
>(5)	Redirect 
>(4)	Martial Dodge 
>(4)	Joint Lock/Throw 
>(4)	Martial Escape 
>(3)	KS: Aikido 12- (INT based) 
>3	Breakfall 12- 
>5	Defense Maneuver 
> 
>     Professional/Background Skills: 
> 
>4	KS: photography 13- (INT based) 
>4	PS: Photographer 13- (INT based) 
>3	Concealment 12- 
>3	Conversation 12- 
>3	Combat Driving (cars) 12- 
>3	Computer Programming 12- 
>1	Fam.: Electronics 8- 
>3	High Society 12- 
>3 	Paramedic 12- 
>3	Persuasion 12- 
>3	AK: campaign city 12- 
>1	TF: cars 
> 
> 
>Powers Cost: 105 
>Total Cost: 150 
> 
>Base Points: 75 
> 
>15	DNPC, normal, useful skills, appear 14- (random DNPC) 
>5	Professional Rivalry (another photographer) 
>       	Psych Limitations: 
>10	  Afraid to tell others about her visions (uncommon, strong) 
 
Surely this is going to seriously adversely affect her interactions 
with the other PCs? 
 
>15	  Wants to help people (common, strong) 
>10	Distinctive Feature: Style Disadvantage 
 
Surely this is only appropriate if you are running a MA campaign? 
 
>10	Susceptability: 2d6 STUN from precognitive visions 
>	  (instant effect, uncommon) 
 
This should be a Side Effect of the Power, not a Disadvantage. How many 
people are going to hit her with a Precog UAO? 
 
>10	Hunted: street gang, 8- (more powerful, limited area) 
> 
>Disadvantages Total: 75 
>Experience Spent: 0 
>Total Points: 150 
 
<snip> 
 
Pretty good! 
qts 
 
Home: qts@nildram.co.uk. 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 15:14:14 -0600 
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net> 
Subject: Re: DREAMRIDERS REORGANIZES (attn: John D) 
 
At 12:08 AM 12/27/1998 -0500, Opus wrote: 
>For : Dreamriders Workshop 
>Contact : Cory Conrad  
>Email : info@dreamriders.com 
>Phone : 514-366-9096 
>Keywords : Comic Books, Dreamriders Workshop 
 
>To no longer receive these press-releases, respond 
>to this message with "remove me" as the subject. 
 
Sounds like an excellent idea.  John D, can we have CHAMP-L removed from 
Dreamriders' mailing list, please? 
 
Damon 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 07:29:29 -0800 
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> 
Subject: Re: Let's do the time warp... again? 
 
At 01:16 PM 12/26/98 -0800, Dale Ward wrote: 
>Greetings! 
> 
>     Geez... you guys must have used up all your imagination trying to figure 
>out what gifts to buy for Christmas! I give you the perfect straight line to 
>give me a mental complex for years and all you can come up with are REAL 
>answers?!? 
 
   Well, it's a little early to be buying Christmas gifts already, isn't 
it?  I'm not even going to worry about it for at least a couple more months. 
- --- 
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page!  [Circle of HEROS member] 
   http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm 
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join? 
   http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 07:35:37 -0800 
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> 
Subject: Re: Selective Senses and Powers/Percise Measurements 
 
At 02:04 PM 12/26/98 -0500, Jason Sullivan wrote: 
> My questions are: 
> For 'selective' senses, how would one model this? 
 
   It depends.  What's the benefit of doing so?  If there's no real benefit 
from this ability, call it a Special Effect, or at most a 3-point 
house-rule Talent. 
 
> For percision senses, such as the ability to determine speed, 
>color, wavelenths of light, sound, to determine picth, distance, etc., how 
>would one model these abilities? 
 
   Determining pitch is already a 3-point Talent, Perfect Pitch.  Many GMs 
also use a 3-point house-rule Talent for distance, calling it Rangefinder. 
I'd just call each of the others a 3-point house-rule Talent as well. 
 
> For absolutely perfect recall, how would one model this 
>(Postcognition?)? 
 
   Eidetic Memory. 
  
> Finally, Rawhide and Roboti-X have the same ammount of Armor, but 
>one (Rawhide) can will his Armor on and off, point by point.  Is this an 
>Advantage on the power? 
 
   Rather than Armor, I'd build it as Force Field, 0 END Persistent.  I 
think that models what you're doing with it better. 
- --- 
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page!  [Circle of HEROS member] 
   http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm 
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join? 
   http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 15:44:39 -0600 
From: "Logan Darklighter" <logand@cyberramp.net> 
Subject: Re: GENKI (The Dark Devil) 
 
- -----Original Message----- 
From: qts <qts@nildram.co.uk> 
To: Champions Mailing List <champ-l@sysabend.org&> Logan Darklighter 
<logand@cyberramp.net> 
Date: Sunday, December 27, 1998 2:55 PM 
Subject: Re: GENKI (The Dark Devil) 
 
 
>On Fri, 25 Dec 1998 22:45:08 -0600, Logan Darklighter wrote: 
> 
>>This is my first outright posting to this group. So please be gentle. 
>>^_^;;;; 
>> 
>> 
>>Mecha Conversion 
>> 
>> 
>>GENKI (Translation: The Dark Devil) 
>> 
>>Val    Char    Cost    Roll    Notes 
>>45     STR      15        16-    12.5 Tons 
>>14     Body     ---        12- 
>>4       SIZE     20 
>>16     DEF     42 
>>23     DEX     39        14-    OCV: 8 / DCV: 6 
>>4       SPD      7                    PHASES: 3, 6, 9, 12 
>> 
>>Total Characteristics Cost: 123 
>> 
>>Movement: Ground: 20" / 40" Superleap: 28" / 56" 
>> 
>>Powers:___________________________________________________________________ 
> 
><snip> 
> 
>Shouldn't these be in an EC? And should the Bulky limitation apply, as 
>they aren't bulky for a mecha? 
> 
><rest snipped> 
 
 
 
Pardon me, but specifically what should be in an elemental control? The only 
thing above your post is the basic stats of the machine. I assume you don't 
mean those? 
 
- -Logan 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 07:27:14 -0800 
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> 
Subject: Re: GENKI (The Dark Devil) (Long) 
 
At 07:03 PM 12/26/98 -0600, Logan Darklighter wrote: 
>-----Original Message----- 
>From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> 
> 
>>>14     Body     ---        12- 
>> 
>>   I might suggest buying up BODY a tad, but otherwise it looks fine. 
> 
>I thought that the thing was already tough enough as it was. I figured if a 
>superhero could even get through the armor, there should be enough there to 
>still take awhile to destroy/disable it. While still giving the Genki ample 
>time to dish out damage or decide to retreat. 
 
   Yes, quite. 
 
>Much of the way the basic stats were laid out reflected perusal of both the 
>source material, and comparison with the M1 A1 Abrams tank that was written 
>up in Hero System Almanac 2, as well as comparisons with some of the mecha 
>listed in VIPER. ( I figured if the Abrams could be considered a baseline 
>for average, then the VIPER tanks are kind of a cheap knock off with tougher 
>weapons but thinner armor. ) 
 
   The difference here is that the Abrams is about enough to give a 
superhero a bad time, while the VIPER vehicles should be a little weaker, 
needing a bit of backup to be an even match.  My impression of Genki is 
that it's supposed to be enough to give a team of experienced heroes a 
tough time all by itself.  BODY is basically its staying power; so how well 
does it hold up when hit with the big bombs? 
 
>The Genki overall is larger than the Abrams, but it's structure, being 
>somewhat "spider-like" is arranged in a more splayed out manner. The armor 
>is thick, yes, but if you manage to break through it, you're going to do a 
>lot more damage because of the complexity of systems and the like. 
 
   If this is the case, then it might better represent the source material 
to buy its BODY *down*. 
 
>>   Also, I'd be very leery of putting these things in an EC to begin with. 
> 
> 
>Technically, it is legal. Technically, it's also somewhat abusive, which is 
>why I was worried. But I figured that since the system is all one unit, I 
>would go with the suggestion in one AC article (can't remember the author, 
>sorry) that states that you apply damage, drains, or anything else that 
>would effect those powers to the EC as a whole, and not to one power only. 
>i.e.; If the system goes down or is partially disabled, it affects all 
>powers, not just one. They lose the DEX, SPD, and levels simultaneusly. 
 
   Well, I'm not arguing against its legality.  I'm just leery about any 
case of Characteristics in an EC. 
   Also, I don't think it's terribly likely that the device would be hit 
with an Adjustment Power -- not that it makes that much difference in this 
case anyway.  (The writer of that article, BTW, was Aaron Allston; I 
recommend a variation on his ideas, which I'll post to the list again if 
requested.) 
 
>>>        Distinctive Features: 
>>>                Four-legged Mecha: Not concealable, Extreme (25) 
>> 
>>   Bear in mind that this would have to be something unusual in the 
>>campaign to count as a DF -- either mecha are rare, or most mecha are 
>>two-legged.  For it being Extreme, I'm guessing the former.  (As I said, 
>>I'm not super familiar with the source material.) 
> 
>I probably should have been more specific. The Genki, at least in BGC, is 
>_very_ distinctive. In fact, it's a custom job, and there's absolutely _no_ 
>mistaking it for anything else. Also, although there might be similar mecha 
>in the world in general, (The Genki is a heavily customized version of a 
>mecha that is sometimes found on the battlefield) you _don't_ generally find 
>them on the streets of MegaTokyo. And it would be considered _extremely_ 
>illegal to have it within the city limits. The Extreme reaction modifier 
>comes from the fact that the thing seems to be pretty terrifying when 
>encountered in the show. It's design seems to be intended specifically to 
>intimidate. If it were possible to give mecha a PRE modifier in Hero System 
>(like in Fuzion) than the Genki would get a major one. 
 
   Given this, it's more appropriate to adjust the wording of the DF than 
the mechanics.  "Unique and terrifying 'mech" would probably better 
describe it.  :-] 
 
>Or, just to go back to the example of the Abrams, I think an Abrams tank 
>driving down _my_ street would definately cause me to do a double, or even a 
>triple take. ^_^;;; 
 
   Actually, the same would be true of a flying man in spandex, but DFs 
aren't generally allowed for that.  It would have to be particularly 
outstanding in the setting to get it -- and what you described qualifies. 
 
>BTW, Bob. Since you're not familiar with the source material, if you like, I 
>can email you a couple of pictures of the thing. 
 
   While I'd be itnerested as a matter of curiosity, it's really how the 
thing compares to what's normally encountered in the setting that really 
matters as well as what kind of response or combat disadvantage it gets. 
 
>>>        Watched: 
>>>                Hou Bang, Mo. Pow. NCI (15) 
>> 
>>   If Hou Bang is the operator who paid for it (as you indicate later on), 
>>this Disadvantage is not appropriate.  The mech already gets its base 
>>points from him. 
> 
>Well, the Hou Bang isn't a person. It's a Triad that funded and built the 
>Genki. I have also seen this Disad used numerous times in the VIPER 
>sourcebook. 
 
   This is one point on which Scott and I disagree, but only to an extent, 
and a lesser extent than in this case.  You see, in VIPER, the vehicle is 
technically paid for by the agent who operates it, so VIPER is a third 
party as far as that Watched is concerned. 
   The point I'm trying to make, then, is that the Vehicle can't be Watched 
by the same entity that paid for its base points; that Watching is assumed, 
so taking it as a Disadvantage would be "double-dipping." 
 
>>>        Physical Limitation: 
>>>                Incredibly Complex to Maintain and Repair (20) 
>>>                Requires Special Training to Operate, 
>>>                All the time, Slight, (15) 
>>>                Requires Two Operators for full capabilities, All the 
>Time, 
>>>Greatly (20) 
>> 
>>   In TUV I'm introducing a new Disadvantage specifically for Vehicles 
>>(though I imagine it could be adapted for use by Bases):  Crew.  Needing 
>>two crew is +5 points; needing special training (3 points' worth) would be 
>>+5 points, though if you need a *lot* of training (9 points' worth, or 3 
>>Skills) that would be another +5 points.  I'm not familiar with the source, 
>>but I gather that a pilot without a gunner could still operate the weapons 
>>with difficulty, 
> 
>Yes, Kou was piloting the Genki alone when he defeated Priss. Kou is also, 
>however, _very_ skilled. 
> 
>so the modifiers I have in that regard wouldn't apply. 
>>The Disdvantage for this mech would be worth 10-15 points (20 if it needs 3 
>>Skills for operation and the pilot cannot operate the weapons), replacing 
>>the latter two Physical Limitations. 
> 
>Does "crew" include ground crew as well as pilot and gunner? As an example 
>pertinent to this discussion, it seemed that after every operation, the 
>Genki needed various tuneups, weapons reloads, fluid replacement, joint 
>checks, etc. It looked like the ground crew for the Genki was about 4-5 
>extra guys aside from the designated Pilot and Gunner. 
 
   No, the Crew is just the operating crew.  The "ground" crew would be 
covered by the "Incredibly Complex to Maintain and Repair" Disad you 
already have there. 
 
>This might be something to consider for things in TUV like F-14 Tomcats and 
>Indy 500 / Formula 1 race cars. 
 
   Well, it's a little late for that, since the Final Draft of the 
manuscript was turned in quite some time ago....  :-] 
- --- 
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page!  [Circle of HEROS member] 
   http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm 
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join? 
   http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 07:27:14 -0800 
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> 
Subject: Re: GENKI (The Dark Devil) (Long) 
 
At 07:03 PM 12/26/98 -0600, Logan Darklighter wrote: 
>-----Original Message----- 
>From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> 
> 
>>>14     Body     ---        12- 
>> 
>>   I might suggest buying up BODY a tad, but otherwise it looks fine. 
> 
>I thought that the thing was already tough enough as it was. I figured if a 
>superhero could even get through the armor, there should be enough there to 
>still take awhile to destroy/disable it. While still giving the Genki ample 
>time to dish out damage or decide to retreat. 
 
   Yes, quite. 
 
>Much of the way the basic stats were laid out reflected perusal of both the 
>source material, and comparison with the M1 A1 Abrams tank that was written 
>up in Hero System Almanac 2, as well as comparisons with some of the mecha 
>listed in VIPER. ( I figured if the Abrams could be considered a baseline 
>for average, then the VIPER tanks are kind of a cheap knock off with tougher 
>weapons but thinner armor. ) 
 
   The difference here is that the Abrams is about enough to give a 
superhero a bad time, while the VIPER vehicles should be a little weaker, 
needing a bit of backup to be an even match.  My impression of Genki is 
that it's supposed to be enough to give a team of experienced heroes a 
tough time all by itself.  BODY is basically its staying power; so how well 
does it hold up when hit with the big bombs? 
 
>The Genki overall is larger than the Abrams, but it's structure, being 
>somewhat "spider-like" is arranged in a more splayed out manner. The armor 
>is thick, yes, but if you manage to break through it, you're going to do a 
>lot more damage because of the complexity of systems and the like. 
 
   If this is the case, then it might better represent the source material 
to buy its BODY *down*. 
 
>>   Also, I'd be very leery of putting these things in an EC to begin with. 
> 
> 
>Technically, it is legal. Technically, it's also somewhat abusive, which is 
>why I was worried. But I figured that since the system is all one unit, I 
>would go with the suggestion in one AC article (can't remember the author, 
>sorry) that states that you apply damage, drains, or anything else that 
>would effect those powers to the EC as a whole, and not to one power only. 
>i.e.; If the system goes down or is partially disabled, it affects all 
>powers, not just one. They lose the DEX, SPD, and levels simultaneusly. 
 
   Well, I'm not arguing against its legality.  I'm just leery about any 
case of Characteristics in an EC. 
   Also, I don't think it's terribly likely that the device would be hit 
with an Adjustment Power -- not that it makes that much difference in this 
case anyway.  (The writer of that article, BTW, was Aaron Allston; I 
recommend a variation on his ideas, which I'll post to the list again if 
requested.) 
 
>>>        Distinctive Features: 
>>>                Four-legged Mecha: Not concealable, Extreme (25) 
>> 
>>   Bear in mind that this would have to be something unusual in the 
>>campaign to count as a DF -- either mecha are rare, or most mecha are 
>>two-legged.  For it being Extreme, I'm guessing the former.  (As I said, 
>>I'm not super familiar with the source material.) 
> 
>I probably should have been more specific. The Genki, at least in BGC, is 
>_very_ distinctive. In fact, it's a custom job, and there's absolutely _no_ 
>mistaking it for anything else. Also, although there might be similar mecha 
>in the world in general, (The Genki is a heavily customized version of a 
>mecha that is sometimes found on the battlefield) you _don't_ generally find 
>them on the streets of MegaTokyo. And it would be considered _extremely_ 
>illegal to have it within the city limits. The Extreme reaction modifier 
>comes from the fact that the thing seems to be pretty terrifying when 
>encountered in the show. It's design seems to be intended specifically to 
>intimidate. If it were possible to give mecha a PRE modifier in Hero System 
>(like in Fuzion) than the Genki would get a major one. 
 
   Given this, it's more appropriate to adjust the wording of the DF than 
the mechanics.  "Unique and terrifying 'mech" would probably better 
describe it.  :-] 
 
>Or, just to go back to the example of the Abrams, I think an Abrams tank 
>driving down _my_ street would definately cause me to do a double, or even a 
>triple take. ^_^;;; 
 
   Actually, the same would be true of a flying man in spandex, but DFs 
aren't generally allowed for that.  It would have to be particularly 
outstanding in the setting to get it -- and what you described qualifies. 
 
>BTW, Bob. Since you're not familiar with the source material, if you like, I 
>can email you a couple of pictures of the thing. 
 
   While I'd be itnerested as a matter of curiosity, it's really how the 
thing compares to what's normally encountered in the setting that really 
matters as well as what kind of response or combat disadvantage it gets. 
 
>>>        Watched: 
>>>                Hou Bang, Mo. Pow. NCI (15) 
>> 
>>   If Hou Bang is the operator who paid for it (as you indicate later on), 
>>this Disadvantage is not appropriate.  The mech already gets its base 
>>points from him. 
> 
>Well, the Hou Bang isn't a person. It's a Triad that funded and built the 
>Genki. I have also seen this Disad used numerous times in the VIPER 
>sourcebook. 
 
   This is one point on which Scott and I disagree, but only to an extent, 
and a lesser extent than in this case.  You see, in VIPER, the vehicle is 
technically paid for by the agent who operates it, so VIPER is a third 
party as far as that Watched is concerned. 
   The point I'm trying to make, then, is that the Vehicle can't be Watched 
by the same entity that paid for its base points; that Watching is assumed, 
so taking it as a Disadvantage would be "double-dipping." 
 
>>>        Physical Limitation: 
>>>                Incredibly Complex to Maintain and Repair (20) 
>>>                Requires Special Training to Operate, 
>>>                All the time, Slight, (15) 
>>>                Requires Two Operators for full capabilities, All the 
>Time, 
>>>Greatly (20) 
>> 
>>   In TUV I'm introducing a new Disadvantage specifically for Vehicles 
>>(though I imagine it could be adapted for use by Bases):  Crew.  Needing 
>>two crew is +5 points; needing special training (3 points' worth) would be 
>>+5 points, though if you need a *lot* of training (9 points' worth, or 3 
>>Skills) that would be another +5 points.  I'm not familiar with the source, 
>>but I gather that a pilot without a gunner could still operate the weapons 
>>with difficulty, 
> 
>Yes, Kou was piloting the Genki alone when he defeated Priss. Kou is also, 
>however, _very_ skilled. 
> 
>so the modifiers I have in that regard wouldn't apply. 
>>The Disdvantage for this mech would be worth 10-15 points (20 if it needs 3 
>>Skills for operation and the pilot cannot operate the weapons), replacing 
>>the latter two Physical Limitations. 
> 
>Does "crew" include ground crew as well as pilot and gunner? As an example 
>pertinent to this discussion, it seemed that after every operation, the 
>Genki needed various tuneups, weapons reloads, fluid replacement, joint 
>checks, etc. It looked like the ground crew for the Genki was about 4-5 
>extra guys aside from the designated Pilot and Gunner. 
 
   No, the Crew is just the operating crew.  The "ground" crew would be 
covered by the "Incredibly Complex to Maintain and Repair" Disad you 
already have there. 
 
>This might be something to consider for things in TUV like F-14 Tomcats and 
>Indy 500 / Formula 1 race cars. 
 
   Well, it's a little late for that, since the Final Draft of the 
manuscript was turned in quite some time ago....  :-] 
- --- 
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page!  [Circle of HEROS member] 
   http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm 
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join? 
   http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 15:48:40 -0600 
From: "Logan Darklighter" <logand@cyberramp.net> 
Subject: Re: Press Release: COLD FUZION IS RECRUITING WRITERS, ADVERTISERS. 
 
Okay, I didn't notice this before, so maybe I spoke too soon. Opus seems to 
be the publishers of a magazine for Fuzion. Maybe this is relevent to the 
list? 
 
- -Logan 
 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
- -- 
 "God does not play dice with the universe; He plays an ineffable 
game of His own devising, which might be compared, from the perspective 
of any of the other players,* to being involved in an obscure and complex 
version of poker in a pitch-dark room, with blank cards, for infinite 
stakes, with a Dealer who won't tell you the rules, and who 
_smiles all the time_." 
   -Neil Gaimen and Terry Pratchett 
    _Good Omens_ 
*i.e., everybody. 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
- -- 
Web page: http://www.cyberramp.net/~logand/ 
- -----Original Message----- 
From: Opus <opus@sprint.ca> 
To: R Talsorian Games <Talsorian@aol.com&> Gold Rush Games 
<GoldRushG@aol.com&> Hero Mailing List <champ-l@sysabend.org&> Fuzion 
Mailing List <fuzion@cyberspace-solutions.net&> press <press@rpg.net&> 
Michael Triggs <MTriggs886@aol.com> 
Date: Sunday, December 27, 1998 3:08 PM 
Subject: Press Release: COLD FUZION IS RECRUITING WRITERS, ADVERTISERS. 
 
 
>For : Dreamriders Workshop 
>Contact : Cory Conrad 
>Email : info@dreamriders.com 
>Phone : 514-366-9096 
>Keywords : Comic Books, Dreamriders Workshop 
> 
> 
>For Immediate Release : COLD FUZION IS RECRUITING WRITERS, ADVERTISERS. 
> 
> 
>Cold Fuzion, the magazine of the Fuzion role-playing game (RPG) system, 
>is looking for writers and advertisers. 
> 
>Debuing in the Spring of 1999, Cold Fuzion will focus on extending and 
>enhancing the Fuzion settings which have come before it, the one to come 
>after, and those created by players alike. Featuring insider news, 
>reviews, articles, and comic serials, Cold Fuzion is poised to become 
>the place for a players monthly Fuzion fix. 
> 
>Dreamriders is looking for writers able to handle the Fuzion system, 
>whether writing material for an existing campaign setting, or creating 
>something entirely new. Previous experience is not necessary, but strong 
>writing skills and knowledge of the system are essential. Payment is 3 
>cents a word to start, payable upon publication. 
> 
>We are also looking for advertisers interested in reaching or target 
>market of role-playing game players through Cold Fuzion and Dreamriders' 
>Fuzion Powered Comics (a blend of traditional comic books and the Fuzion 
>RPG system). Being a focal point of Fuzion interest we will be able to 
>deliver  thousands of eyes a month to your ad. If you are an advertiser 
>and would like more information on rates, or wish to see a preview of 
>what to expect from Cold Fuzion or the Fuzion Powered comics you may 
>request it from info@dreamriders.com 
> 
>On tap for the first few issues, the first full release version of 
>Heroic Abilities by Jason A. Dour, a Foxbat adventure by Bruce Harlick, 
>a Foxbat comic serial, and Material on Starfire Masterforce by Gary E. 
>Townsend and Shaintar by Sean Fannon. 
> 
>-*- 
> 
>For more information on Dreamriders Workshop, contact Cory Conrad at 
>info@dreamriders.com, or surf over to the DW website : 
>www.dreamriders.com. To no longer receive these press-releases, respond 
>to this message with "remove me" as the subject. 
> 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 16:28:42 -0600 
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net> 
Subject: Re: Selective Senses and Powers/Percise Measurements 
 
>At 02:04 PM 12/26/98 -0500, Jason Sullivan wrote: 
>> Finally, Rawhide and Roboti-X have the same ammount of Armor, but 
>>one (Rawhide) can will his Armor on and off, point by point. 
 
I had another thought on this, but it may not fit your character concept: 
suppose you buy Armor in several small sections like I mentioned earlier; 
no modification is needed to allow the character to turn them off.  Now, 
suppose you buy some additional points with a Limitation based on 
Concentration (at the 1/2 DCV level) Limitation and yet more based on 
Concentration (0 DCV level).  These two highest levels of Armor protection 
should probably be downgraded to Constant and cost END.   
 
What this would simulate is a character who can increase his own Armor 
protection through an act of will, but past a certain point his body begins 
to stiffen up and become inflexible (half DCV); at his highest level of 
Armored protection, he's completely rigid and can't move at all.  He may be 
*aware* of his surroundings (something Concentration as written doesn't 
allow) but he won't be able to act on them.  Allowing awareness of 
surroundings, but halving (or negating, as the case may be) both OCV and 
DCV may make this a fair trade-off with ordinary Concentration. 
 
Seems like it would work for "living metal" or "living stone" type 
characters.  But as I said, it may not fit your character concept.  
 
Damon 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 15:41:37 -0600 
From: "Logan Darklighter" <logand@cyberramp.net> 
Subject: Recent crossposting by Dreamriders, et al 
 
Um. Guys? Do these people have permission to advertise on the list? Heck. On 
the Fuzion one as well? Is this relevent? Yes it's comic related, but it's 
not game related directly. Just asking the List organizers if this is okay 
or not. 
 
- -Logan 
 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
- -- 
 "God does not play dice with the universe; He plays an ineffable 
game of His own devising, which might be compared, from the perspective 
of any of the other players,* to being involved in an obscure and complex 
version of poker in a pitch-dark room, with blank cards, for infinite 
stakes, with a Dealer who won't tell you the rules, and who 
_smiles all the time_." 
   -Neil Gaimen and Terry Pratchett 
    _Good Omens_ 
*i.e., everybody. 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
- -- 
Web page: http://www.cyberramp.net/~logand/ 
- -----Original Message----- 
From: Opus <opus@sprint.ca> 
To: R Talsorian Games <Talsorian@aol.com&> Gold Rush Games 
<GoldRushG@aol.com&> Hero Mailing List <champ-l@sysabend.org&> Fuzion 
Mailing List <fuzion@cyberspace-solutions.net&> press <press@rpg.net> 
Date: Sunday, December 27, 1998 12:53 PM 
Subject: DREAMRIDERS REORGANIZES 
 
 
>For : Dreamriders Workshop 
>Contact : Cory Conrad 
>Email : info@dreamriders.com 
>Phone : 514-366-9096 
>Keywords : Comic Books, Dreamriders Workshop 
> 
> 
>For Immediate Release : DREAMRIDERS REORGANIZES 
> 
>Dreamriders Workshop is please to announce the finalization of its 
>internal restructing which has seen many of the titles solicited through 
>November 1998 cancelled and resolicited. "It was clear that we simply 
>did not get the word out about what we were doing, and that hurt our 
>potential sales," said Dreamriders President Cory Conrad. "In addtion, 
>problems at the printers meant our books faced significant delays. 
>Clearly shipping the books weeks late is as bad as not shipping them at 
>all." 
> 
>In an effort to solve this problem Dreamriders brought on board 
>additional investors and moves its titles to different printers. The 
>addtion of Off Color Digital Designs and several key people is also 
>meant to improve our production schedual and quality of work. 
> 
>"Dreamriders has always been about commitment to the craft of comics," 
>said Chris Butcher, author of the reorganization plan, "and not 
>necessarily the monetary gain from itů. I am a firm believer that good 
>product sells. Of course, it has to be promoted correctly and it has to 
>find it's niche, but it will sell." 
> 
>These changes affected the previous ship dates of FLAT BLACK #1 through 
>#3, as well as the REVENANCE mini-series which will undergo a greyscale 
>toning for its re-release in the Fall of 1999. The FEDERAL TACTICAL 
>RESPONSE GN and the planned FEDERAL TACTICAL RESPONSE UNLIMITED monthly 
>series will be merged, resulting in a monthly oversized book of 48 pages 
>per issue. 
> 
>The ship dates for both PERIPHERY and RABID MONKEY, VO.2, remain 
>unchanged. PERIPHERY is a bi-monthly 48-page anthology produced by 
>Archtype Studios and Dreamriders Workshop. Each issue features a diverse 
>blend of fiction from a number of small-press creators.  The RABID 
>MONKEY is a all-ages color book which follows the misadventures of a 
>michevious gibbon with a one-word vocabulary; all for only $2.95. Find 
>out why the RABID MONKEY was spotlighted in Previews and selected as "On 
>the Edge" comic of the month by Wizard Magazine. 
> 
>-*- 
> 
>For more information on Dreamriders Workshop, contact Cory Conrad at 
>info@dreamriders.com, or surf over to the DW website : 
>www.dreamriders.com. To no longer receive these press-releases, respond 
>to this message with "remove me" as the subject. 
> 
> 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 16:48:59 -0600 
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net> 
Subject: Re: Press Release: COLD FUZION IS RECRUITING WRITERS, ADVERTISERS. 
 
At 03:48 PM 12/27/1998 -0600, Logan Darklighter wrote: 
>Okay, I didn't notice this before, so maybe I spoke too soon. Opus seems to 
>be the publishers of a magazine for Fuzion. Maybe this is relevent to the 
>list? 
 
This isn't the Fuzion list.   
 
Nor is it a list devoted to comic books per se, much less the Opus line of 
books specifically.  If the post soliciting writers and artists was the 
only one I'd seen appear here, I wouldn't have thought anything about it. 
But if, as I suspect, we are going to be "treated" to every outgoing 
announcement relating to any Opus product, then I object, and I'd like to 
have the CHAMP-L list removed from Opus's automailer. 
 
If it doesn't relate to the Hero System, it's spam.  Rabid Monkey isn't 
Hero.  Fuzion isn't Hero (though Champions: New Millenium is, and might be 
appropriate for this list as well as the Fuzion list). 
 
Damon 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 18:14:33 -0500 
From: werther@hilander.com (...jason schneiderman...) 
Subject: Re: Selective Senses and Powers/Percise Measurements 
 
> For example, he can shut off his vision, his hearing, and just 
>about all of his senses. 
 
As a sidenote... perhaps a few levels of Flash Defense for this? (After 
all, being able to turn off your visual receptors is a heck of a lot more 
effective than just shutting your eyes) 
 
- -Jason 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: 27 Dec 1998 17:38:44 -0500 
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> 
Subject: Re: Selective Senses and Powers/Percise Measurements 
 
- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- 
Hash: SHA1 
 
"BG" == Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> writes: 
 
BG>    It depends.  What's the benefit of doing so?  If there's no real 
BG> benefit from this ability, call it a Special Effect, or at most a 
BG> 3-point house-rule Talent. 
 
Three points per sense that can be affected, I think.  And I am inclined to 
make it require a half-phase non-attack action per sense switched on or 
off.  As a 0 phase or no time action it is too cheap for 'immunity to Flash'. 
 
Otherwise everything as Bob wrote it. 
 
- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- 
Version: GnuPG v0.9.0 (GNU/Linux) 
Comment: For info see www.gnupg.org 
 
iD8DBQE2hrb0gl+vIlSVSNkRArIWAKCJiP3Aemj9Oo0l3kvC5MxuIZ1hCACePThc 
HTE3snU37/MU297qWwPPah0= 
=Il7P 
- -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- 
 
- --  
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>    \ If Happy Fun Ball begins to smoke, get 
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ away immediately. Seek shelter and cover 
GPG Key: same as my PGP 5 (DH) key  \ head. 
 
------------------------------ 
 
Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 18:25:23 EST 
From: GoldRushG@aol.com 
Subject: Re: Recent crossposting by Dreamriders, et al 
 
<< Um. Guys? Do these people have permission to advertise on the list? Heck. 
On 
the Fuzion one as well? Is this relevent? Yes it's comic related, but it's 
not game related directly. Just asking the List organizers if this is okay 
or not. >> 
 
  They are a licensed producer of Fuzion products (comics, RPGs, et al), 
AFAIK. 
 
  Mark @ GRG 
 
------------------------------ 
 
End of champ-l-digest V1 #110 
***************************** 


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