Digest Archives Vol 1 Issue 121
From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 1999 4:05 PM
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #121
champ-l-digest Tuesday, January 5 1999 Volume 01 : Number 121
In this issue:
Re: Other Mailing Lists
Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
Re: CAK interpretations.
Re: Seattle/Everett Area?
Re: Champs/FH: Job Packages for the Church of Zudo[was Other Mailing Lists] - long
Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
Re: Teleporting Others
"Homing"
Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
Re: "Homing" / ATTN: Digital Hero authors
Re: "Homing" / ATTN: Digital Hero authors
Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
Re: "Homing"
Re: Other Mailing Lists
Re: "Homing"
Personal immunity and absorption
Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
Re: "Homing"
Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
Re: Personal immunity and absorption
Re: "Homing"
Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
Teen Superhero Concepts
Re: Teen Superhero Concepts
Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
Re: Teen Superhero Concepts
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 14:41:30 -0800 (PST)
From: Dale Ward <daleaward@rocketmail.com>
Subject: Re: Other Mailing Lists
Greetings!
I wanted to reply to everyone that responded to my first message so,
rather than make separate replies, I'm gonna do it all in one.
First off, thanks to each of you. I was hoping I wasn't the only one who
felt this way.
*****
[Paraphrasing Rather Than Quoting]
B.C.Holmes, Dr. Nuncheon, and Chris Taylor - (re: FH discussions) Want
one? Start one!
Good point! I've always been a better listener than a speaker, but that's
no excuse for lurking. I'll try to be a little more active on the subject.
*****
Scott Nolan - (re: same) Poster Good! Lurker Bad! <THWAP!>
Thank You, Sir! May I have another! <jk> <GRIN>
*****
sheehys - Provided directions to the FH list.
Excellent! As I said, I don't think I'll give up THIS list, but there's
always room for another source.
*****
Incidentally, I don't remember who brought up the idea of putting the
genre in the message subject (so that people who weren't interested in that
genre could delete or skip the messages), but I think you may be cheating
yourself out of some good tips that way. Some things translate very well from
one genre to another.
*****
Last, but not least, there seems to be a discussion brewing on Beginner
Character Package Deals.
I've never been a big fan of package deals... they always seemed to
dilute the player's creativity (I could be wrong).
If I understand the concept correctly, the idea is to provide the
character with a pre-defined set of skills, powers, and disads... hopefully
point-balanced to zero so that a "package bonus" won't be necessary.
My question is... Why bother? It seems to be a lot of work for very
little reward, and you often wind up giving the player disads that he/she
isn't willing to play. Let the player decide how he wants the character to
begin.
If you must have certain skills involved, set them up as Everyman skills
at an 8 or less roll... perhaps making them optional depending on what type of
character the player is designing. You get about the same effect without
forcing the player to use up any of his/her disad points.
I will, however, study Brian's character "classes" and see what I can
come up with, in the spirit of non-lurking.
For the moment, though, I have to go discipline (pronounced KILL) my
cats. It sounds like they have knocked over a very large Christmas tree...
And, we didn't even have one this year!
Dale A. Ward
(contemplating felicide)
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 17:33:16 -0600
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net>
Subject: Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
At 12:48 PM 1/4/1999 -0800, David W. Salmon wrote:
>On a related note ...
>
>So how does one apply damage to the driver of a vehicle if the driver uses
>the vehicle to do a move-thru on a wall ? Assume the vehicle has no chance
>of going thru the wall.
>
>I would think that you would apply the move-thru damage calculations to the
>vehicle using the vehicles mass and velocity giving the vehicle it's DEF
>versus the damage. Then apply the move-thru damage calculations to the
>driver using the drivers mass and the vehicles velocity giving the driver
>his DEF against the damage. I would also think that the damage should be
>reduced somehow if the driver was wearing a seatbelt or if an airbag was
>deployed on impact.
>
>Yes/No/Maybe ... ?? Anyone care to take a stab at actual numbers ?
I believe you have the right idea:
* Vehicle crashes into a wall it cannot penetrate; vehicle comes to an
abrupt halt, taking damage as from an attempt to Move Through the wall
* Driver continues to move forward *within* the vehicle, at the vehicle's
original velocity
* Driver impacts steering wheel/dashboard, which he cannot penetrate;
driver comes to an abrupt halt, taking damage as if he'd attempted a Move
Through against his own dashboard at high speed
Perhaps this will be of some use:
"In any crash, the crew and passengers will take some damage. When a
crash has occurred, find out by what amount the vehicle's speed has been
abruptly altered. Examples:
- A vehicle crashes into a bunker at 23" and stops dead. The car went
from 23" to 0"; the amount by which the speed was changed is 23".
- A car is T-boned and moves 4" to the side; the amount is 4".
- A motorcycle moving 10" has a head-on with a van and ends up moving
10" backwards [due to Knockback; this is covered elsewhere]; the amount is
20".
That damage is the amount of dice damage each person in the car takes from
associated shock, whiplash, etc. If a character has stated that he's
buckled his seat belt, he takes only half this damage. PD and body armor
also take off this amount. For instance, let's say our motorcycle rider
who's just impacted on the van in the example above has a PD of 8 and a
really good combat suit, which is also 8 PD. He'll need 'em, because he's
just taken 20 dice damage -- for, say, 20 BODY and 73 STUN. 20 - 16 is 4,
so he'll take 4 BODY...73-16 is 57 STUN, so he's undoubtedly out until next
Labor Day. However, an average man (PD 2) with no armor, ramming into an
immovable object at 23" and abruptly stopping, takes 23 BODY; 23 - 2 is 21,
so he's going to be squashed like a bug. Controlled braking does not do
this sort of damage, but crashes do. (So do falls. Don't drive your car
off the top of a building.) Motorcycles do not have seat belts."
- -- the above taken from AUTODUEL CHAMPIONS by Aaron Allston, page 31
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 15:32:07 -0800 (PST)
From: Dale Ward <daleaward@rocketmail.com>
Subject: Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
Greetings!
- ---Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> wrote:
>
> Calculate the damage done to the wall by the Move Through, based on the
> Vehicle's STR (and/or Size; I present some options for that in TUV) and its
> velocity.
>
Speaking of the TUSV, has this legendary tome been published and released
yet? If it has, I fear that I missed notification.
Dale A. Ward
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 17:52:46 -0600
From: Tim Statler <tstatler@igateway.net>
Subject: Re: CAK interpretations.
Filksinger wrote:
>
> It was once suggested in one of the HERO books, as an example for
> Disadvantages (I don't recall which book)
As stated by others, Dark Champions.
that, in a 4 color super campaign,
> Uncommon was will not personally kill, Common would not allow others around
> them to kill, and Very Common would cause them to risk life and limb for
> _anybody_.
I think this is what I'll go with. Using the uncommon, common, and very
common interpretaion.
>
The reason I was asking, is one character I'm creating is a Valkyrie,
and while not allowed to kill herself, is also not allowed to take
messures above normal to prevent death. (She can wrap wounds, call an
abulance, etc. but not use anything to heal)
Tim Statler
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 15:40:31 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filksinger@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Seattle/Everett Area?
Yo!
Filksinger
- -----Original Message-----
From: Ron Abitz <abitz@richpoor.com>
To: Hero List <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Date: Friday, January 01, 1999 8:07 PM
Subject: Seattle/Everett Area?
>Is there anyone on the list in the Seatle/Everett area of Washington State?
>
> Ron Abitz
> abitz@richpoor.com
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 18:47:50 -0500
From: "Dave Mattingly" <dave@haymaker.win.net>
Subject: Re: Champs/FH: Job Packages for the Church of Zudo[was Other Mailing Lists] - long
John D offers:
>Well, I have a bunch of Fantasy Hero Package Deals up on my site, but
>they are all Archetype packages, as opposed to Job packages (although
>I do also have a bunch of Justice Inc Career Packages which were fun
>to make).
Much the same here. At http://www.haymaker.org/haym16.html, I have several
job packages and several fantasy archertype packages, which might be partly
usable to you.
Dave Mattingly
http://haymaker.org
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 15:48:03 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
From: Michael Sprague <msprague@eznet.net>
<snip>
>Sorry. Y2K is indeed a serious issue, but it also gets blown out of
>proportion by people who don't understand what the problems are (again, I'm
>not picking on MWStrong) . I have even seen outright untruths about the
>issue on the evening news.
Considering that evening news consistently gets any tech or science story
messed up, this isn't a surprise. I have yet to see a single program that
can actually tell you the correct date the millenium will end. (Hint: It
isn't Dec 31, 1999.)
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 19:48:22 -0500
From: "Dave Mattingly" <dave@haymaker.win.net>
Subject: Re: Teleporting Others
Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
>I highly recommend the article on Teleport
>on the Haymaker web-site.
David W. Salmon <dwsalmon@earthlink.net>
>I would be interested in that Teleport article myself. What is the address
>for the haymaker web site ?? Which issue of Haymaker was it in ??
Yes, I'd like to read that one too!
Dave Mattingly
http://www.haymaker.org
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 09:49:26 -0800 (PST)
From: shaw@caprica.com (Wayne Shaw)
Subject: "Homing"
Someone mentioned an article on Homing advantages for attack powers a while
back; where is this article to be found?
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 17:17:03 -0800 (PST)
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
Subject: Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
Filksinger writes:
> Considering that evening news consistently gets any tech or science story
> messed up, this isn't a surprise. I have yet to see a single program that
> can actually tell you the correct date the millenium will end. (Hint: It
> isn't Dec 31, 1999.)
Hm...personally, I've never seen a program that will tell me the date the
millennium will end at all, it not being something that people consider it a
big issue to have their computers answer.
Actually, you can get the correct answer to this question from various programs
(as well as incorrect answers) -- I'm sure I could find the answer with enough
work on a web browser.
The end of the millenium being, of course, Dec 31, 2000, because there is no
year 0 (the first millenium is year 1-1000, inclusive; second is 1001-2000,
etc). This is one of the more useless factoids some people like to bring up
about the millenium, mostly relevant as an observation of the relative lateness
of the concept of 'zero' in mathematics.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 22:01:07 -0600
From: Bryant Berggren <voxel@theramp.net>
Subject: Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
At 05:17 PM 1/4/99 -0800, Anthony Jackson wrote:
> The end of the millenium being, of course, Dec 31, 2000, because there is
> no year 0 (the first millenium is year 1-1000, inclusive; second is
> 1001-2000, etc). This is one of the more useless factoids some people
> like to bring up about the millenium, mostly relevant as an observation
> of the relative lateness of the concept of 'zero' in mathematics.
Actually, the end of the millenium occurs on January 1st, 2001. Until the
first second of that day, the millenium isn't over, yes?
OK, so I'm a wiseass. I agree, it's a useless factoid, especially since the
1999/2000 break is the pragmatically important one (because of our 2-digit
dating conventions).
- --
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to
do nothing." -- attributed to Edmund Burke (1729-1797)
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Visit the SoapVox at http://www.io.com/~angilas/soapvox.html
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 21:36:39 -0800
From: "David W. Salmon" <dwsalmon@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
Bob,
You wrote "...Anyone inside takes all the STUN and BODY,
minus the sum of the Vehicle's DEF and their own personal defenses..."
I guess I don't see why the driver would get the vehicles DEF against the
damage done.
Unless you are treating the vehicle like a suit of armor, which I can kind
of see. But if you do that then if someone with an actual suit of armor does
a move-thru on a wall then would you take the suit of armor's STR (and/or
Size) to calculate the damage (like you did with the vehicle) and then apply
the armors DEF and the personal DEF of the individual inside the armor
against the damage done by the move-thru? I know that's a silly way to do it
but I guess Monday's are my "not-so-quick-to-pick-up-on-things" day. What is
your reasoning for giving the driver the vehicles DEF in a move-thru ?
Dave
- -----Original Message-----
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
To: Champions News Group <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Date: Monday, January 04, 1999 2:58 PM
Subject: Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
>At 12:48 PM 1/4/99 -0800, David W. Salmon wrote:
>>On a related note ...
>>
>>So how does one apply damage to the driver of a vehicle if the driver uses
>>the vehicle to do a move-thru on a wall ? Assume the vehicle has no chance
>>of going thru the wall.
>
> Calculate the damage done to the wall by the Move Through, based on the
>Vehicle's STR (and/or Size; I present some options for that in TUV) and its
>velocity.
> The wall takes all the BODY, minus its own DEF. The Vehicle takes all
>the BODY, minus its own DEF. Anyone inside takes all the STUN and BODY,
>minus the sum of the Vehicle's DEF and their own personal defenses. If
>they are using seat belts, air bags, or similar safety devices, they only
>take half damage (such devices can be built using Damage Reduction).
>---
>Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
> http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
>Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
> http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
>
>
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 21:53:53 -0600
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net>
Subject: Re: "Homing" / ATTN: Digital Hero authors
At 09:49 AM 1/4/1999 -0800, Wayne Shaw wrote:
>Someone mentioned an article on Homing advantages for attack powers a while
>back; where is this article to be found?
"Get the Homing Advantage". It was posted in the Digital Hero section of
www.herogames.com, but like most things was only there temporarily. My
printed copy lists Steve Gale as the author, who says "I'd appreciate your
feedback. If you have any comments, questions, suggestions, or the like,
please e-mail them to me." Sadly, Steve didn't give his email address in
the text of the article. Oh, you could email him while the article was
posted: his name was hyperlinked with a 'mailto:' tag. That doesn't help
once the article is taken offine and all you have left is a printed copy.
Steve's article refers back to a new Advantage called Seeking, part of "The
Wonders of Energy Blast" by Casey McGirt. Also on Digital Hero for a
while, also only contained a hyperlinked email address.
So, a plea to those who submit articles for Digital Hero: if you want
feedback, or if you'd just like to help out those poor unfortunates who
missed seeing your work during its 15 minutes of fame at Digital Hero,
*please* put a visible email address, not just a hyperlink, in the body of
your article.
Damon
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 13:05:16 -0800 (PST)
From: shaw@caprica.com (Wayne Shaw)
Subject: Re: "Homing" / ATTN: Digital Hero authors
>At 09:49 AM 1/4/1999 -0800, Wayne Shaw wrote:
>>Someone mentioned an article on Homing advantages for attack powers a while
>>back; where is this article to be found?
>
>"Get the Homing Advantage". It was posted in the Digital Hero section of
>www.herogames.com, but like most things was only there temporarily. My
Ah. Oh, well.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 00:21:38 -0500
From: geoff heald <gheald@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
At 05:17 PM 1/4/99 -0800, Anthony Jackson wrote:(In what I assume was _not_
a joke)
>Filksinger writes:
>
>> Considering that evening news consistently gets any tech or science story
>> messed up, this isn't a surprise. I have yet to see a single program that
>> can actually tell you the correct date the millenium will end. (Hint: It
>> isn't Dec 31, 1999.)
>
>Hm...personally, I've never seen a program that will tell me the date the
>millennium will end at all, it not being something that people consider it a
>big issue to have their computers answer.
>
As Filksinger had just made reference to the "evening news," I think the
logical inference is that "program" meant TELEVISION program, not computer
program.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 00:17:26 -0500
From: geoff heald <gheald@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
At 03:48 PM 1/4/99 -0800, you wrote:
>From: Michael Sprague <msprague@eznet.net>
>
><snip>
>>Sorry. Y2K is indeed a serious issue, but it also gets blown out of
>>proportion by people who don't understand what the problems are (again, I'm
>>not picking on MWStrong) . I have even seen outright untruths about the
>>issue on the evening news.
>
>
>Considering that evening news consistently gets any tech or science story
>messed up, this isn't a surprise. I have yet to see a single program that
>can actually tell you the correct date the millenium will end. (Hint: It
>isn't Dec 31, 1999.)
>
>Filksinger
>
>
I read a news story that directly addressed this issue. It pointed out
that 100 years ago, the scientific and political communities ran pretty
much without interference from the public, but today, public opinion can
influence major decisions. So, since the tide of public opinion has turned
against the official time-keepers, the 20th century will be the only
century to have only 99 years.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 21:18:36 -0800
From: Christopher Taylor <ctaylor@viser.net>
Subject: Re: "Homing"
At 09:49 AM 1/4/99 -0800, you wrote:
>Someone mentioned an article on Homing advantages for attack powers a while
>back; where is this article to be found?
>
This is the seeker advantage I made, havent playtested it much, but it
seems to
be reasonable at first glance.
SEEKING: With this advantage, the attack will continue to attempt to hit a
target until it succeeds. It is similar to continuous, in that the effect will
act on it's own, on the attacker's phases, but different in that it will only
take effect once. The attack is launched and the attacker must guide the
attack, taking a half phase rolling to hit each phase until the attack
succeeds. The power costs END only when first launched, and requires the
attacker to be able to perceive the target for it to hit. If the attacker
cannot see the target any longer, the seeker will launch into a straight line
like a normal attack that missed, and stop when it hits a surface or at it's
maximum range. The direction traveled may be determined randomly if not clear,
and as such may return to the attacker!
For a +1/2 advantage, the attacker can switch targets on his phase, choosing
another person for the seeker to go after. Like Continuous, the attacker
cannot
launch another attack while the seeker is in effect. The seeking power may be
shut off at any time by the attacker. With Uncontrolled, this power becomes
very frightening, and with Autofire, it becomes horrific. Autofire must be
bought with the extra cost if this advantage is used. Consider this advantage
to have a stop sign next to it.
Seeking is best used for gunboat style 'mask and unmask' type of attacks, and
with limited uses. A charge does not begin to use it's power until it actually
hits, so the player does not need to buy continuous charges to use seeker.
Base level: +1/4 advantage
Can change targets: +1/2 advantage
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sola Gracia Sola Scriptura Sola Fide
Soli Gloria Deo Solus Christus Corum Deo
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 00:10:47 -0500
From: geoff heald <gheald@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Other Mailing Lists
At 02:41 PM 1/4/99 -0800, you wrote:
>*****
> sheehys - Provided directions to the FH list.
>
> Excellent! As I said, I don't think I'll give up THIS list, but there's
>always room for another source.
>
Oop! I missed that one. Could somebody send it to me?
>*****
>Last, but not least, there seems to be a discussion brewing on Beginner
>Character Package Deals.
> I've never been a big fan of package deals... they always seemed to
>dilute the player's creativity (I could be wrong).
> If I understand the concept correctly, the idea is to provide the
>character with a pre-defined set of skills, powers, and disads... hopefully
>point-balanced to zero so that a "package bonus" won't be necessary.
>
Ack! That's not it at all. The package bonus is the point. (I've never
been a fan of the 4th ed. package rules and subbed in an older version).
If I create a superhero who has a Theme, I can put his powers in an
Elemental Control and save some points. Bonus points for having a coherent
concept. Package Deals do that on the heroic level. Also, there's some
bonus for being a little generic.
For those just tuning in, the "new" Hero package deal says, "Total up
skills and advantages, subtract disadvantages, subtract 3 for being a
package." The older system had the GM come up with a bonus based on
combat-usefulness and survival-orientedness of the skills and advantages.
As I see it, the new system encourages you to make package deals as small
as your GM will allow, so you can take a bunch of them ("I took the
Soldier, Cavelry, Knight, Noble, and Paladin packages") so you get that 3
point bonus lotsa times, but the old way encouraged you to pack everything
into one so you'd get a bigger bonus ("And the Samurai deal incudes Flower
Arranging +5"). Packing in non-combat skills increases the size of your
bonus, so Paladins are _Encouraged_ to take KS:Courtly Manners and
KS:Heraldry of the Flaness and other, more esoteric skills.
Lastly, Disadvantages in a Package Deal don't count against the character's
total disadvantages, which can be helpful. (I once had a player trying to
convert an AD&D Paladin ask "can I take Disadvantages above the limit if I
don't get payed for them?")
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 01:07:11 -0500
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Re: "Homing"
At 09:18 PM 1/4/99 -0800, Christopher Taylor wrote:
>
>SEEKING: With this advantage, the attack will continue to attempt to hit a
>target until it succeeds. It is similar to continuous, in that the effect
will
>act on it's own, on the attacker's phases, but different in that it will only
>take effect once. The attack is launched and the attacker must guide the
>attack, taking a half phase rolling to hit each phase until the attack
>succeeds. The power costs END only when first launched, and requires the
>attacker to be able to perceive the target for it to hit. If the attacker
>cannot see the target any longer, the seeker will launch into a straight line
>like a normal attack that missed, and stop when it hits a surface or at it's
>maximum range. The direction traveled may be determined randomly if not
clear,
>and as such may return to the attacker!
>
>For a +1/2 advantage, the attacker can switch targets on his phase, choosing
>another person for the seeker to go after. Like Continuous, the attacker
>cannot
>launch another attack while the seeker is in effect. The seeking power may be
>shut off at any time by the attacker. With Uncontrolled, this power becomes
>very frightening, and with Autofire, it becomes horrific. Autofire must be
>bought with the extra cost if this advantage is used. Consider this advantage
>to have a stop sign next to it.
>
>Seeking is best used for gunboat style 'mask and unmask' type of attacks, and
>with limited uses. A charge does not begin to use it's power until it
actually
>hits, so the player does not need to buy continuous charges to use seeker.
>
>Base level: +1/4 advantage
>
>Can change targets: +1/2 advantage
Were I to use this house rule, I'd add a +1 "Fire and Forget" advantage that
did not require me to pay attention to the power in order for it to seek it's
target.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 22:06:29 -0800
From: Rick Holding <rholding@ActOnline.com.au>
Subject: Personal immunity and absorption
Can a person with personal immunity to an attack form apply absorption
to that attack?
I was thinking about the Cyclops/Havoc effect from the X-men where they
get stronger from each others attack form without suffering any adverse
effects. This would seem to be a case of personal immunity as is
allowed under the description and the absorption power but it is unclear
if the write-ups allow this application (in fact, it seems to indicate
the opposite). Any comments?
- --
Rick Holding
If only "common sense" was just a bit more common...
or if you prefer... You call this logic ?
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 08:59:51 -0600 (CST)
From: "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com>
Subject: Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
On Mon, 4 Jan 1999, David W. Salmon wrote:
> You wrote "...Anyone inside takes all the STUN and BODY,
> minus the sum of the Vehicle's DEF and their own personal defenses..."
>
> I guess I don't see why the driver would get the vehicles DEF against the
> damage done.
Er...why /wouldn't/ you? If you're in a car, and I shoot you, the bullet
has to go through the car first, expending some of its energy.
> Unless you are treating the vehicle like a suit of armor, which I can kind
> of see. But if you do that then if someone with an actual suit of armor does
> a move-thru on a wall then would you take the suit of armor's STR (and/or
> Size) to calculate the damage (like you did with the vehicle)
Er, no...most armors don't have their own motive power - they use the
motive power of the wearer (I suppose some types of powered armor would
not be like this) and the strength of the wearer to do damage in a
Move-Through. So you'd use the person's strength. (If the armor has any
STR-enhancing capabilities, you would use that, too.) The reason my STR
doesn't add to, say, a car collision damage is because there's no
reasonable way for me to add my STR to it...in a suit of armor, there is a
way.
> and then apply
> the armors DEF and the personal DEF of the individual inside the armor
> against the damage done by the move-thru?
That is completely right. Just because you put on a suit of armor doesn't
mean you lose your personal PD/ED - they add together.
> What is
> your reasoning for giving the driver the vehicles DEF in a move-thru ?
Basically, the vehicle is absorbing some of the impact. If you want your
vehicle to not protect passengers in a crash (really unsafe design, made
of plastic, whatever), then put a limitation on the Armor (Does not
protect occupants in collisions, probably about -1/4 or so)
J
Hostes aliengeni me abduxerent. Jeff Johnston - jeffj@io.com
Qui annus est? http://www.io.com/~jeffj
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 10:26:24 EST
From: llwatts@juno.com (Leah L Watts)
Subject: Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
>You wrote "...Anyone inside takes all the STUN and BODY,
>minus the sum of the Vehicle's DEF and their own personal defenses..."
>
>I guess I don't see why the driver would get the vehicles DEF against
the
>damage done.
IIRC, modern cars are designed to absorb some of the impact. You can see
this in car races on TV -- the car gets trashed, but the driver walks
away because most of the kinetic energy was absorbed by the car.
Leah
___________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 07:09:44 -0800
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: "Homing"
At 09:18 PM 1/4/99 -0800, Christopher Taylor wrote:
>At 09:49 AM 1/4/99 -0800, you wrote:
>>Someone mentioned an article on Homing advantages for attack powers a while
>>back; where is this article to be found?
>>
>This is the seeker advantage I made, havent playtested it much, but it
>seems to
>be reasonable at first glance.
Looking this over, I think it looks quite good, with plenty of
restrictions and caveats to make it playable. I think I'd double the value
of the Advantages, though, to +1/2 for basic and +1 to be able to change
targets.
And I echo Scott Nolan's suggestion of a "Fire and Forget" element for
+1.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 07:21:51 -0800
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
At 03:32 PM 1/4/99 -0800, Dale Ward wrote:
>Greetings!
>
>---Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> wrote:
>>
>> Calculate the damage done to the wall by the Move Through, based on the
>> Vehicle's STR (and/or Size; I present some options for that in TUV) and its
>> velocity.
>>
> Speaking of the TUSV, has this legendary tome been published and
released
>yet? If it has, I fear that I missed notification.
There's no S any more (it's just TUV), and release has been pushed to a
hopeful February or March.
Mind you, that's still unofficial. When something official is
announced, you'll probably be able to find the information on the Hero
Games website.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 07:49:26 -0800
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
At 10:26 AM 1/5/99 EST, Leah L Watts wrote:
>>You wrote "...Anyone inside takes all the STUN and BODY,
>>minus the sum of the Vehicle's DEF and their own personal defenses..."
>>
>>I guess I don't see why the driver would get the vehicles DEF against
>the
>>damage done.
>
>IIRC, modern cars are designed to absorb some of the impact. You can see
>this in car races on TV -- the car gets trashed, but the driver walks
>away because most of the kinetic energy was absorbed by the car.
Part of this, of course, is being strapped in. If a race car driver
didn't have his restraints on, a crash would leave him good for nothing but
the sausage factory.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 07:16:45 -0800
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Personal immunity and absorption
At 10:06 PM 1/5/99 -0800, Rick Holding wrote:
>Can a person with personal immunity to an attack form apply absorption
>to that attack?
>
> I was thinking about the Cyclops/Havoc effect from the X-men where they
>get stronger from each others attack form without suffering any adverse
>effects. This would seem to be a case of personal immunity as is
>allowed under the description and the absorption power but it is unclear
>if the write-ups allow this application (in fact, it seems to indicate
>the opposite). Any comments?
I was going to say, "No way, immunity is immunity," until you mentioned
this thing between Cyclops and Havok. I knew that they were immune to the
effects of each others' powers, but during my comic-reading years I never
saw them get stronger when they attacked each other.
I'm still leaning toward a "no" answer, but some way of modeling the
above effect should still be devised.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 09:08:57 -0800
From: Christopher Taylor <ctaylor@viser.net>
Subject: Re: "Homing"
>>This is the seeker advantage I made, havent playtested it much, but it
>>seems to
>>be reasonable at first glance.
>
> Looking this over, I think it looks quite good, with plenty of
>restrictions and caveats to make it playable. I think I'd double the value
>of the Advantages, though, to +1/2 for basic and +1 to be able to change
>targets.
> And I echo Scott Nolan's suggestion of a "Fire and Forget" element for
>+1.
Well, originally it was that price, but if you look at it.. it doesnt end
up being all that different from a normal attack. Each of your phases you
get to direct the attack, as if you were firing one anyway. The only
advantage is that it doesnt cost any END until you fire it again. Seeking
doesnt make the attack uncontrolled, you have to pay for that (to get the
fire and forget effect), and its not constant, it just looks like it
because it has a continuing effect. The actual POWER doesnt continue, just
the chance for it to go off. With those considerations, it doesnt end up
being all that valuable unless the right advantages are put on it... such
as autofire and uncontrolled.
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sola Gracia Sola Scriptura Sola Fide
Soli Gloria Deo Solus Christus Corum Deo
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 07:35:00 -0800
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Vehicle Damage and Pilot STUN
At 09:36 PM 1/4/99 -0800, David W. Salmon wrote:
>Bob,
>
>You wrote "...Anyone inside takes all the STUN and BODY,
>minus the sum of the Vehicle's DEF and their own personal defenses..."
>
>I guess I don't see why the driver would get the vehicles DEF against the
>damage done.
>Unless you are treating the vehicle like a suit of armor, which I can kind
>of see. But if you do that then if someone with an actual suit of armor does
>a move-thru on a wall then would you take the suit of armor's STR (and/or
>Size) to calculate the damage (like you did with the vehicle) and then apply
>the armors DEF and the personal DEF of the individual inside the armor
>against the damage done by the move-thru? I know that's a silly way to do it
>but I guess Monday's are my "not-so-quick-to-pick-up-on-things" day. What is
>your reasoning for giving the driver the vehicles DEF in a move-thru ?
The idea is that the vehicle provides *some* resistance to the impact
against the barrier. The idea seems reasonable, and it does have
precedence in the construction of Force Wall.
Then, observing a number of cases where there were unrestrained persons
both inside and outside a vehicle, I've seen that the persons inside the
vehicle has taken injuries slightly less serious than those who were
unrestrained missiles and hit the barrier directly -- enough to allow the 3
DEF of a typical automobile to provide defense for those inside.
On the other hand, someone else's example (which I think was quoted from
Autoduel Champions) explaining the unrestrained person impacting the
dashboard and taking full damage certainly has merit. If you want to treat
it that way, I certainly wouldn't call it wrong, especially if you're
trying to go for something reasonably like realism in your game. (I may
even change it to that if there's ever a second edition of TUV.)
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
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------------------------------
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 13:02:46 -0600
From: "Guy Hoyle" <ghoyle1@airmail.net>
Subject: Teen Superhero Concepts
Anybody got any good names/concepts for some teen superheroes?
Thanks in advance,
Guy
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
"For every expert there is an equal and opposite expert."
- --Charles Fort
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 11:38:49 -0800
From: Shelley Chrystal Mactyre <scm@mactyre.net>
Subject: Re: Teen Superhero Concepts
At 01:02 PM 1/5/99 -0600, Guy Hoyle wrote:
>Anybody got any good names/concepts for some teen superheroes?
>
>Thanks in advance,
>
>Guy
My favorite PC name from a game I ran a year or so back was "General
Electric" -- made for a rather interesting hunted. =)
Shelley Chrystal Mactyre
http://www.mactyre.net
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 12:05:40 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filksinger@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
>Filksinger writes:
>
>> Considering that evening news consistently gets any tech or science story
>> messed up, this isn't a surprise. I have yet to see a single program that
>> can actually tell you the correct date the millenium will end. (Hint: It
>> isn't Dec 31, 1999.)
>
>Hm...personally, I've never seen a program that will tell me the date the
>millennium will end at all, it not being something that people consider it
a
>big issue to have their computers answer.
Evening news program. Or any television program. Not a computer program.
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 11:34:00 -0800
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Teen Superhero Concepts
At 01:02 PM 1/5/99 -0600, Guy Hoyle wrote:
>Anybody got any good names/concepts for some teen superheroes?
It kinda depends on how serious or silly you want to get, but here are a
few ideas that just come out of my head on seeing the question:
- Bodacious Dude, a physically perfect surfer guy who's tough as a rock
- -- and twice as intelligent.
- Game Boy, a super-genius who likes to pattern his gadgets after ideas
and concepts found in various games.
- Mad Dash, a cross-country speedster.
- Lightfoot, a dancer (female, I'd make it) who learned karate, savate,
and capoeira to further her art but ends up using it for crime fighting as
well.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
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------------------------------
End of champ-l-digest V1 #121
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Date: Monday, May 24, 1999 03:08 PM