Digest Archives Vol 1 Issue 148
From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 1999 5:23 PM
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #148
champ-l-digest Tuesday, January 19 1999 Volume 01 : Number 148
In this issue:
Re: Loser Heroes(Ambush Bug scenario)
Re: superleap attacks
Re: superleap attacks
Re: Character: Bilbo Baggins
Fwd: Loser Heroes
Re: Loser Heroes
Re: superleap attacks
Re: superleap attacks
Re: Loser Heroes
Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
Re: Loser Heroes(Ambush Bug scenario)
Re: Camp Councilor
Re: Loser Heroes
Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
Re: Loser Heroes
Re: Loser Heroes
Re: Loser Heroes (fwd)
Re: Loser Heroes
Re: superleap attacks
RE: Loser Heroes
Re: Loser Heroes
Gambit Write-up...
Re: Problems with Uncontrolled and Continuous (Attn: Steve Long)
Re: Fwd: Loser Heroes
RE: Loser heroes
demoralization [was: Uncontrolled and Continuous]
Re: Gambit Write-up...
Re: Trigger Question
Re: Bad Habits of Poor Gamers
Re: Problems with Uncontrolled and Continuous (Attn: Steve Long)
Re: Gambit Write-up...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 07:26:15 EST
From: Leuszler@aol.com
Subject: Re: Loser Heroes(Ambush Bug scenario)
In a message dated 1/19/99 1:37:34 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
redroach@sprynet.com writes:
> My all time favorite, Ambush Bug!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> TV
Excellent suggestion! And if you want to run a really, really funny game,
pick up a copy of "Don't Ask", which is a DC Heroes scenario book with an
adventure featuring AB. There will be a little translating work to do, but
nothing too difficult.
Imagine what would happen if Ambush Bug had complete control of time and
space. What a riot! And the book comes with an Ambush Bug mask!
Mike Leuszler
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 07:13:56 -0500
From: "Ronald A. Miller" <rabmiller@email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: superleap attacks
Is the Lord of Leaping a member of the 12 Knights of Christmas? Heh (feeble
attempt at humor). This does remind me of something though... I boggled
the GM's mind once when a Leaper I had dove off a ten story building. The
GM says he'd roll for damage, but I corrected him by saying:
"Any character with Superleap can inherently avoid FALLING DAMAGE depending
on how many inches in Superleap he has. What (Superleaping Character) comes
up must be able to come down without normal damage otherwise we'd have
Superleaps with one charge :-D" Thus as a side effect to Superleap is
Immunity to Falling Damage... Comments?
>
>My bouncy character, The Lord of Leaping, has a multipower with several
>leaping maneuvers in it, including:
>
> 4u 36" Leap No Range Mod
> 4u 10" Leap NRM + Area Effect Line STR
>
>The No Range Mod allows him to land exactly where he wants to, instead of
>rolling to hit the hex.
>
>His Area Effect Line allows him to do multiple leap throughs and leap bys,
>which is quite appropriate for the multiple bounce question, although Any
>Area or Selective Radius might be more appropriate.
>
>
>Dave Mattingly
>http://haymaker.org
>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 07:09:43 -0500
From: "Ronald A. Miller" <rabmiller@email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: superleap attacks
> The use of 180 degree turns in the original post indicated to me that
>the person was to return to the same spot. If you want to go somewhere
>else, include a short range teleport (this will allow you to get over
>holes in the ground). Flight could also be used with appropiate
>restrictions.
I really don't want to lose sight of the concept here. If Skyshot does a
leap attack (BTW if you're thinking of it like some kind of
linear/horizontal jump then that's not what I had in mind, it's more like a
power jump up and come down HARD on the target) then he runs the risk of
being Grabbed by the opponent and wrangled. All these other concepts seem
to go off the pretense that it's some kind of
rediculous-anime-type-background-lines-flying-in-the-air-for-a-full-minute-m
ove (really, no offense intended). All I really want is an attack based
around Superleap that can get the PC in and out of there in one move. All
the opinions so far are appreciated, though, and may be used as minor attack
variants, so thanks.
> You don't need damage resistance or extra PD because you are not really
>doing a moveby on the target. It just looks like it. Hence you don't
>take any damage and need the extra defences.
The hit would be ultimately based around bodily contact, thus STR and PD
would be taken into consideration for the move's concept.
Miller
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 99 07:11:48 -0400
From: John P Weatherman <asahoshi@nr.infi.net>
Subject: Re: Character: Bilbo Baggins
Scott Nolan nolan@erols.com 1/19/99 1:53 AM
>BILBO BAGGINS (c. Third Age 3019)
>
>13 INT 3
I'd up this to say 15 or so. Bilbo's vast knowledge base
in the form of KS, Languages, and AK seem to call for a
"doubling" over base int.
>13 EGO 6
I also think this may be a little low. Bilbo was able
to stand up to Gandolf on more than one occation, even
if he were eventually reasoned into accepting the Istari's
position. IMO this calls for a really exceptional EGO.
>1 SPD -13
I wouldn't actually buy this down. As a young hobbit,
Bilbo was very quick, dodging through orcs and out
hidden doors and the like. For that time frame, he
was likely speed 3 (+0.7). Now, after the Ring's
"stretching" I'd relax him to his base 2, but all the
way down to 1 seems a little extreme.
>1 WF,Swords
Sting was actualy a dagger which served "as well as a
sword". I's probably call this a WF: Dagger, but
either works.
>3 Scholar
>2 KS: Elves 12-
>2 KS: Dwarves 12-
>2 KS: Dunedain 12-
>2 KS: Hobbits 12-
>2 KS: Eldar and Dunedain History 12-
I'd add 2 KS: First Age 12- as well.
>5 Watched,"Elrond",more powerful,noncombat influence,limited
> area,mild,appear 8-
IMO, he was watched by Gandolf, at least as much as by Elrond,
who tended to appear whenever he was needed, though still rarely.
I'd add:
15 Watched: Gandolf,more powerful,noncombat influence, mild,appear 11-
>15 Psychological Limitation,"Tired from burden of carrying One
> Ring",common,strong
Also
10 Psychological Limitation, Desires to regain the One
Ring",uncommon,strong
>Scott C. Nolan
>nolan@erols.com
All and all, an excellent adaptation... :)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 07:38:19 EST
From: Leuszler@aol.com
Subject: Fwd: Loser Heroes
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To: sbennie@dowco.com
Subject: Re: Loser Heroes
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 07:37:25 EST
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In a message dated 1/19/99 4:06:32 AM Eastern Daylight Time, sbennie@dowco.com
writes:
> How many campaigns out there actively use comic relief characters
> (villains or NPC heroes)? Admittedly Champions player characters often
> prove that "comedy is easy, dying is hard", but I've always found a few
> swattable loons to be an awful lot of fun to throw at PCs. I've never
> saddled the PCs with a bumbling hero groupie, but that might be an
> interesting thing to do too.
I ran a DC heroes campaign with a few comedic characters. Of course, this was
during the first edition when none of us knew of the word restraint, and one
of the PCs had built a character who could do darn near anything, thanks to
slight rule bending. Of course, he was an emotionally disturbed alien with
all kinds of unplayable disads. This guy was a member in standing of the
Power Gamer Hall of Fame. I still managed to give the group a good game and
run silly villains.
Let's see, there was Melvin the Vampire, who wasn't really a vampire since he
didn't like to stay up all night.
Mental was a parody of Mento by way of Forrest Gump. He would create such
illusions as care bears and smurfs.
Drip Dry was a water elemental with bladder problems.
I'd have to check my notes for the rest, but I think you get the idea.
Mike Leuszler
- --part0_916749500_boundary--
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 07:09:30 -0600
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net>
Subject: Re: Loser Heroes
At 03:56 AM 1/19/1999 -0500, geoff heald wrote:
>At 11:21 PM 1/18/99 -0800, you wrote:
>These guys fought the Defenders in the Howard the Duck Annual:
>Bullseye, an ex-federal agent now branded for life by Native Americans he
>was investigating undercover who tattooed a big target on his chest. I
>think he used suction cup tipped arrows.
>Some lame Valkerie chick.
>Another guy I don't remember.
>And, The Black Hole, a man with a bit of neutronium embedded in his chest.
>He wears an all yellow costume except the area around his eyes is black as
>is the vortex he can create in his chest. His powers? "Like his namesake,
>The Black Hole sucks." He can draw people or things into the hole in his
>chest, never to be seen again. He was destroyed when someone pushed his
>hand (that is, The Black Hole's hand) into his chest. He sorta sucked
>himself in and disappeared.
The lame Valkyrie chick was Brunhilde. The two guys you didn't remember
were Dr. Angst (a poor man's Dr. Strange...a *very* poor man's Dr. Strange)
and the Spanker, a former school principal fired for excessive use of
corporal punishment. He wore two ping-pong paddles in holsters.
These guys, being villains, aren't what was asked for. Howard the Duck
could be, though. Let's see...Squirrel Girl appeared in an issue of Iron
Man, I think.
Damon
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 23:56:14 +1000
From: "Lockie" <jonesl@cqnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: superleap attacks
you can jump 'up' to counteract falling damage, with leap and strength leap.
i think it takes time, and it's good to limit leaper like this- otehrwise he
can land fine while unconcious.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 09:07:39 -0500
From: "Dave Mattingly" <dave@haymaker.win.net>
Subject: Re: superleap attacks
>Thus as a side effect to Superleap is
>Immunity to Falling Damage... Comments?
Immunity to falling damage less or equal to than the inches in Superleap,
yes. Of course, you have to be conscious and otherwise unoccupied to use
that ability.
Dave Mattingly
http://haymaker.org
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 00:01:34 +1000
From: "Lockie" <jonesl@cqnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: Loser Heroes
loser heroes- the 'a' man. a guy in a black shirt and tattered cape, with a
red 'a' on his chest. he keeps insisting that he 'has powerful friends' and
waves around some plot device or another. I made him a recurring villain,
each campaign had him once, before banishing him to some other plane or
somesuch. now in my latest campaign, ALL of them will be turning up- at
once, about sixty of them, dressed idetically, wielding baseball bats,
screaming 'You SEE? i said i had powerful friends!' It'll take my lot about
six seconds.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 08:05:16 -0600 (CST)
From: "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com>
Subject: Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
On Mon, 18 Jan 1999, Jesse Thomas wrote:
<I'm piggybacking, so someone else wrote this, not Jesse>
> > Now, if those same people showed up every 10 years to argue that
> >1950 was the last year of the 40's, 1970 was the last year of the 60's,
> >1980 was the last year of the 70's, etc, then perhaps things would be
> >different.
Well...no...see, 'the 40s' is a different concept from 'the fourth decade
of the 20th century'.
One is 1940-1949.
The other is 1941-1950.
J
Hostes aliengeni me abduxerent. Jeff Johnston - jeffj@io.com
Qui annus est? http://www.io.com/~jeffj
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 09:18:30 -0500 (EST)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: Loser Heroes(Ambush Bug scenario)
On Tue, 19 Jan 1999 Leuszler@aol.com wrote:
> > My all time favorite, Ambush Bug!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> >
> > TV
>
> Excellent suggestion! And if you want to run a really, really funny game,
> pick up a copy of "Don't Ask", which is a DC Heroes scenario book with an
> adventure featuring AB. There will be a little translating work to do, but
> nothing too difficult.
>
> Imagine what would happen if Ambush Bug had complete control of time and
> space. What a riot! And the book comes with an Ambush Bug mask!
It also comes with the two most powerful characters in existance (I forgot
their names, but they could do anything) as well as a write up for the
Phantom Stranger. The Strabger's write-up was a hoot, as it consisted of
nothing but asteriks next to all the characteristics and powers section.
At the bottom of the page you get: *The Phantom Stranger doesn't go in for
this sort of thing.
- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html
"...Nothing is a coincidence if it happens to bolster the conclusions we
already seek. This is how we professionals discover the messages hidden in
seemingly disparate objects or events."
James Finn Garner
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 14:21:32 +0000
From: Chris Hartjes <chris@ergmusic.com>
Subject: Re: Camp Councilor
chrisopher spoor wrote:
>
> Well Steven said nicely what i pulled on my players. 150pt with no limit
> on disadvantages and no caps and a warning that I knew the rules a lot
> better then they did. one came up with a STR 89, DEX 43 and no real
> defences. I responded with snipers with real good skill levels and area
> attacks.
Brian Warrow plays in my Champs game so I am quite familiar with his
character creation style, but I felt that in order to maintain some sort
of balance when creating characters there needed to be limits put in
place. When you're dealing with experienced gamers, they tend to know
how to get the most for their points.
The limits were 60 active points on any one power, and the characters
were built on 100+100. In a few cases total attacks went above 12DC but
I made exceptions where I deemed it necessary. I don't think that
anyone who is in the game would think the active point limits make for a
less enjoyable game.
I played in a campaign once where there were no limits on the powers,
and it simply degenerated into a contest between us and the GM, where
his NPCS were always perfectly tailored to beat the snot out of the
group.
I prefer not to have such an adversarial relationship with my players.
The limits are in place to start but they can certainly go above them
with experience.
Chris Hartjes
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 08:57:48 -0600 (CST)
From: Curt Hicks <exucurt@exu.ericsson.se>
Subject: Re: Loser Heroes
> From: tdj723@webtv.net (thomas deja)
> >From: sbennie@dowco.com (Scott Bennie)
>
> >>Marvel loser villains? Pretty much anyone Bill
> >> Mantlo came up with when he transformed
> >> Alpha Flight into Awful Flight, one of the
> >> most spectacular destructions of a comic
> >> title in history.
>
> I think he's only looking for loser heroes; mentioning the Mantlo ALPHA
> FLIGHt *does* bring to mind the embarassing Mannikin, a kid who could
> slide up and down the evoltionary scale....a silly character.
>
Actually, Mannikin could summon a brutish caveman type, an evolved future
man, and an amoeba thing that could dissolve stuff. These all appeared at
the same time and Manikin was also present.
Now, **Evolvo Lad** from the Legion of Superheroes comic could slide up
and down the evolutionary scale. Evolvo Lad was not a member of the Legion,
but another group whose name escapes me at the moment.
Of course, speaking of the Legion, there's always the Legion of Substitute
Heroes - Polar Boy, Color Kid, Chlorophyll Kid, Stone Boy and others ?
Curt
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 10:24:08 -0600
From: "Guy Hoyle" <ghoyle1@airmail.net>
Subject: Re: Y2k bug (from predictions)
> From: Dr. Nuncheon <jeffj@io.com>
> On Mon, 18 Jan 1999, Jesse Thomas wrote:
> <I'm piggybacking, so someone else wrote this, not Jesse>
> > > Now, if those same people showed up every 10 years to argue that
> > >1950 was the last year of the 40's, 1970 was the last year of the
60's,
> > >1980 was the last year of the 70's, etc, then perhaps things would be
> > >different.
>
> Well...no...see, 'the 40s' is a different concept from 'the fourth decade
> of the 20th century'.
>
> One is 1940-1949.
> The other is 1941-1950.
Actually, the fourth decade would be 1931-1940.
1st: 1901-1910
2nd: 1911-1920
3rd: 1921-1930
4th: 1941-1940
etc.
Guy
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 10:20:56 -0600
From: "Guy Hoyle" <ghoyle1@airmail.net>
Subject: Re: Loser Heroes
Don't forget the Great Lakes Avengers, whose names I may be getting wrong:
Big Bertha, Flatman, Terry Dactyl, and the amazing Mr. I, one of my
personal faves.
Guy
- ----------
> From: Curt Hicks <exucurt@exu.ericsson.se>
> To: champ-l@sysabend.org
> Subject: Re: Loser Heroes
> Date: Tuesday, January 19, 1999 8:57 AM
>
> > From: tdj723@webtv.net (thomas deja)
> > >From: sbennie@dowco.com (Scott Bennie)
> >
> > >>Marvel loser villains? Pretty much anyone Bill
> > >> Mantlo came up with when he transformed
> > >> Alpha Flight into Awful Flight, one of the
> > >> most spectacular destructions of a comic
> > >> title in history.
> >
> > I think he's only looking for loser heroes; mentioning the Mantlo ALPHA
> > FLIGHt *does* bring to mind the embarassing Mannikin, a kid who could
> > slide up and down the evoltionary scale....a silly character.
> >
>
> Actually, Mannikin could summon a brutish caveman type, an evolved future
> man, and an amoeba thing that could dissolve stuff. These all appeared
at
> the same time and Manikin was also present.
>
> Now, **Evolvo Lad** from the Legion of Superheroes comic could slide up
> and down the evolutionary scale. Evolvo Lad was not a member of the
Legion,
> but another group whose name escapes me at the moment.
>
> Of course, speaking of the Legion, there's always the Legion of
Substitute
> Heroes - Polar Boy, Color Kid, Chlorophyll Kid, Stone Boy and others ?
>
> Curt
>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 11:25:56 -0500
From: David W Cheung <dwcheung@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Loser Heroes
At 08:56 PM 1/18/99 -0800, Chad Riley wrote:
>Hey All, I was wondering if you could think of some of Marvel's less
>respected heroes. I'm doing something with them I already have a core of
>the Lightning Rods, Frogman, the Osprey (the guy from the old Marvel
>Superheroes Game), and Captain Ultra. I'm looking for guys and girls who
>have never really measured up to the big leagues, characters who were
>made that way on purpose, not just ones you can't stand. However aside
>from the Lightning Rods (formerly Great Lakes Avengers), I don't want
>anyone who already is in a team (like Speedball). Any ideas? The heroes
>introduced on assistant editor's month would be good. I need
>predominately Marvel characters but if they're lame enough I will take
>DC Characters.
>
There was always the SPOT, who SpiderMan fought first. For those of you
who don't remember, his body was white and covered with black spots of
various sizes and acted as teleprtational/dimensional portals. He could
even take them off his body and put them all over.
HUMBUG, also from SpiderMan, who used tech devices to replicate different
sounds from the Insect Kingdom at different intensities for different effects.
I think there was a DREADNOUGHT, not positive about the name, he tried to
join the Avengers. He had a suit of battle armor that didn't work properly
half the time... Yeah, kinda like the Maine I guess... :)
If you want to consider CYPHER from the New Mutants. OOOOO... Languages.
Scare me more.
CHANCE and GOMI from Fallen Angels: Chance enhances mutant powers, Gomi
had artificial TK powers which he could use to fire force blasts... he was
friends/owner of two cybernetic lobsters! (what could be sillier than
cyber-crustaceans?!)
HAYWIRE, from Squadrom Supreme: shot thin metal wire from his hands... came
from nowhere.
There was always the Marvel-Year-in-Review issue with Mutants that didn't
make the grade:
LEAFMASTER: shot leaves at high pressure from his hands.
SNEEZING LOUISE: Super-expulsive-sneezing.
and, my favorite, DEPRESSO: Had the power to bum out everyone within
earshot: "We're gonna DIE!"
Also from Marvel-YIR:
PRESS-ON: Had super fingernails that could cut through anything.
Unfortunately, the rest of her body couldn't take the pressure of such use,
so her fingers bled and got sore often.
WEIGHTWATCHER: could tell you the caloric, fat, almost anything dietetic
about any foodstuffs on contact.
GO-GETTER: Mentally controlled traffic lights.
If you wanted to go into The Legion of Subs... well, tons of guys there:
Antennae Boy, Arm-Fall-Off Boy, Plaid Lad, Double-header, etc.
I am sure there are more, but these are just off the top of my head. :)
BTW, I am new to the list serve, and just thought I'd say HI! This
certainly seemed like a good first post to respond to.
I am a die-hard Champions fan for the last 15 years... it is still the best
system around! I am in Atlanta and am currently running a campaign of
criminals who are being forced to work for UNTIL to apprehend their old
boss, who abandoned them anyway. Odd, I know... My favorite character I
use is called FROSTFIRE. I will often sign things with that name or with
my other, given nickname: 2HYPER. Guess why... But my NAME is David. :)
I hope to get lots of good info and stuff from the list. I've even got
some questions maybe y'all could help with, but I will save that for later...
David/Frostfire/2Hyper
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 11:36:13 -0500 (EST)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: Loser Heroes (fwd)
Some comments from a friend of mine on the Legion of Substitue Heroes:
> Of course, speaking of the Legion, there's always the Legion of Substitute
> Heroes - Polar Boy, Color Kid, Chlorophyll Kid, Stone Boy and others ?
Ah, now I know why I got this forwarded to me. :-)
The original Subbies were Polar Boy (the leader, could project cold; later
joined the Legion and eventually became their last leader before Cham
reformed the team years later), Fire Lad (could breathe fire; in later,
"goofier" issues in the 80's, he seemed to exhibit *less* control of his
power), Color Kid (could change things different colors), Stone Boy (could
turn himself to stone; power varied according to the writer as to whether
or not he became a "walking statue" or just an immobile paperweight),
Night Girl (had super-strength, probably at least on par with Timber Wolf,
but only at night or in the dark...Lydia hung around with the Legion some,
partly because she was sleeping with Cosmic Boy, and partly because Shadow
Lass was just a convenient person to be around when you have that
power...the absolute skimpiest of the Mike Grell costumes except possibly
for Laurel Kent), and Chlorophyll Kid (could make plants grow super-strong
and super-fast).
After Polar Boy and (I think) Night Girl left in the late 80's, the Subs
picked up some rejected applicantants from waaaaay back when Wildfire
joined in Superboy #199. That was Infectious Lass (could immediately
render her target ill, but her control was less-than-ideal) and Porcupine
Pete (body covered with quills, which he could project...aimlessly). That
was also the Keith Giffen Subs, played purely for laughs -- teamed with
Superman to battle Ambush Bug, for example.
The Subs used to meet in a cave (possibly the old Batcave, rediscovered in
the 30th Century, but it was never spelled out). When the Legion moved
into their Mike Grell-designed Citadel, the Subs got their old
"pranged yellow rocket-ship" HQ, which they kept for a looooong while.
I think Evolvo Lad was one of the Heroes of Lallor, a sort of "indy"
Legion on another planet. Renamed Elvo at some point for an issue or
three, probably until they realized what kind of cracks could be made
outta that ("Elvo has left the building!")
- --
Steve Kramer -=- scooter (at) otd dot com -=- http://www.otd.com/~scooter/
"You! Get me a drink! Make it large, strong, and to go,
and put it on Godot's tab!"
Der Rock the Destroyer, from _Buck Godot: PSmIth_
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 08:32:27 -0800
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Loser Heroes
At 11:26 PM 1/18/99 -0600, Thomas Vickers wrote:
>My all time favorite, Ambush Bug!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You know, I had thought to mention him when I saw the question, and
figured that someone else would.
I suppose one could count the Legion of Substitute Heroes and their
Auxiliary, as portrayed by Keith Giffen, though it was stated that teams
were preferred to be left out of this.
Just about anyone in the Tick's City would work too. Going by the TV
rendition, I'd vote for the Tick himself (of course), Arthur (for different
reasons), Big Shot, and Die Fliedermaus as top candidates.
Then there's Darkwing Duck. A couple of his associates would fit into
this category too: Comet Guy, Gizmoduck, and another fellow who was
transformed from a duck into a dinosaur (I forget his name offhand).
One musn't forget the two greatest funny-animal martial artists of all
time, Karate Kat and Hong Kong Phooey.
And, of course, the greatest "loser hero" of all time, the man who
practically defines the phrase, Captain Klutz!
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 08:24:57 -0800
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: superleap attacks
At 09:37 PM 1/18/99 -0500, Dave Mattingly wrote:
>>Buy Superleap, with the +1/4 Advantage Bouncable. For each Skill Level
>>used, the character can strike something in mid-leap and change direction
>>(somewhat like the way Energy Blasts are Bounced).
>> One could even add the Cumulative Advantage to this, and allow the
>>character to increase his Leaping by the amount of his Superleap with each
>>Bounce (and there you have Bouncing Boy!).
>> It's probably a little tweakish, but it's also probably a good starting
>>point for finding the "right" way. :-]
>
>
>My bouncy character, The Lord of Leaping, has a multipower with several
>leaping maneuvers in it, including:
>
> 4u 36" Leap No Range Mod
> 4u 10" Leap NRM + Area Effect Line STR
>
>The No Range Mod allows him to land exactly where he wants to, instead of
>rolling to hit the hex.
>
>His Area Effect Line allows him to do multiple leap throughs and leap bys,
>which is quite appropriate for the multiple bounce question, although Any
>Area or Selective Radius might be more appropriate.
Yeah... though as I look at it, this seems even more tweakish than what
I suggested (no offense intended).
Oh, and with NRM he'd still have to roll to hit the hex; he just
wouldn't suffer any range penalties.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 13:43:29 -0500
From: Brian Wawrow <bwawrow@mondello.toronto.fmco.com>
Subject: RE: Loser Heroes
There was a guy who scrapped SpiderMan a couple of times called the Leaper.
He was presented with this bad French accent and barely a hint of irony.
Also, the mentalist with low self esteem, Mentalo or something like that.
Upon hearing his name, Bruce Banner exclaimed, 'That LOSER?'
Hawkeye wasn't exactly a total loser but next to everyone else in the
Defenders, he was a total Potsy. roll call: Dr. Strange, Namor, Silver
Surfer [!], The Hulk and... [ahem] Hawkeye.
Old New Mutant members Cypher, Rusty and Skids. Poor.
Generation X member Husk. Why bother?
In the 'Losers We Love' category, Zan & Jayna, the Wonder Twins! Form of...
a goat! Shape of an ice slide!
Rick Jones' first incarnation as Capt. America's sidekick Bucky
There's a really good homepage dedicated to half-assed heros in Marvel
called Attack of the Second Stringers here:
http://www.flash.net/~jeanneb/index.html
Later
BRI
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 11:22:44 -0800
From: Mark Lemming <icepirat@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Loser Heroes
Curt Hicks wrote:
>
> Of course, speaking of the Legion, there's always the Legion of Substitute
> Heroes - Polar Boy, Color Kid, Chlorophyll Kid, Stone Boy and others ?
Infectious Lass and Grow-arm-hair lad were pretty cool.
- -Mark
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 14:24:54 -0500
From: Jorge Cadavid <cadavid@gate.net>
Subject: Gambit Write-up...
Hey Guys, new to the list. Started playing Champions a few months ago.
Wanted to get some tips on making a character. The theme for the
champions game I'm in is for mutants. Now from what I hear people
usually play your basic bricks (hulk, jugger), or the EP (torch,
iceman), or martial artists (wolverine). I wanted to make something
slightly different and I went with guy no one has ever mentioned of
playing before....Gambit!
I thought to make him a martial artist/EP/thief/slight mentalist. The
campaign is only 250 pts. Someone mentioned to me about getting the
heromaker since I'm new. I was wondering if anyone might have a copy of
it online somewhere or on there webpage, where I might go to download
it. Or if anyone might know where I can get it. Also if anyone hear
might have a write-up for Gambit.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 13:15:14 -0500
From: David_A._Fair@fc.mcps.k12.md.us (David A. Fair)
Subject: Re: Problems with Uncontrolled and Continuous (Attn: Steve Long)
>>Um...the agents can probably ignore the fire....your average viper
>agent takes
>>a couple turns to go down from 1d6 KAs.
Most people get shot once, maybe twice, and the fight is out of them.
Not because they have lost too much BODY or too much STUN but because
being shot tends to demoralize and take the fight out of all but the
must fanatical of individuals. You may want to consider this fact when
you play your NPC's: No one really knows how many BODY they have to
begin with, nor how many they have left.
Dave
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 11:29:40 -0800
From: Mark Lemming <icepirat@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Fwd: Loser Heroes
Leuszler@aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 1/19/99 4:06:32 AM Eastern Daylight Time, sbennie@dowco.com
> writes:
>
> > How many campaigns out there actively use comic relief characters
> > (villains or NPC heroes)?
>
> Let's see, there was Melvin the Vampire, who wasn't really a vampire since he
> didn't like to stay up all night.
>
> Mental was a parody of Mento by way of Forrest Gump. He would create such
> illusions as care bears and smurfs.
>
> Drip Dry was a water elemental with bladder problems.
>
> I'd have to check my notes for the rest, but I think you get the idea.
Towel Master:
Had terry cloth armor and a wet towel. Though he was kind of dangerous.
Armor-All:
Several GMs used this guy. He was completly impervious to any of the
attacks of the players. He had a very small NND. After the bricks got
tired of trying to get through his defenses, he was useually picked up
and placed upside down in a trash can.
- -Mark Lemming
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 12:23:08 -0800
From: Christopher Taylor <ctaylor@viser.net>
Subject: RE: Loser heroes
I still like Keep Squeezin Them Monkeys Lad that Wizard magazine invented,
just the name cracks me up, who knows what his powers are supposed to be.
Every month Wizard has a crappy old time hero or villain in their magazine,
the Mort of the Month, just goofy crappy guys.
However, on this vein... I LIKED Spot, I thought he had really cool powers,
and with the right training and gear he could be godawful.
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sola Gracia Sola Scriptura Sola Fide
Soli Gloria Deo Solus Christus Corum Deo
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 15:37:39 -0500
From: Brian Wawrow <bwawrow@mondello.toronto.fmco.com>
Subject: demoralization [was: Uncontrolled and Continuous]
This is a good point. I find that using the bleeding rules will even make
PC's think twice about pressing an attack under poor tactical circumstances.
If you pop someone and tell them they're at 3BOD and they'll be bleeding
2BOD/Turn until they can stabalize their wounds, they tend to look closely
at their options with an eye to self preservation. It's at this point in the
game where psych lims can mean the difference between life and death.
] Most people get shot once, maybe twice, and the fight is out of them.
] Not because they have lost too much BODY or too much STUN but because
] being shot tends to demoralize and take the fight out of all but the
] must fanatical of individuals. You may want to consider this fact when
] you play your NPC's: No one really knows how many BODY they have to
] begin with, nor how many they have left.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 12:57:00 -0800
From: Christopher Taylor <ctaylor@viser.net>
Subject: Re: Gambit Write-up...
>iceman), or martial artists (wolverine). I wanted to make something
>slightly different and I went with guy no one has ever mentioned of
>playing before....Gambit!
>
>I thought to make him a martial artist/EP/thief/slight mentalist. The
>campaign is only 250 pts. Someone mentioned to me about getting the
>heromaker since I'm new. I was wondering if anyone might have a copy of
>it online somewhere or on there webpage, where I might go to download
>it. Or if anyone might know where I can get it. Also if anyone hear
>might have a write-up for Gambit.
There are a few pages with writeups of everyone, but Gambit is one of those
characters that the writers didnt actually flesh out ahead of time and keep
adding powers to as time goes on. He started out a quick martial arts guy
with energy charging ability and has since gained inhuman (spiderman level)
agility and so forth. I personally think hes kind of boring but he would
make a fun character to play.
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sola Gracia Sola Scriptura Sola Fide
Soli Gloria Deo Solus Christus Corum Deo
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 14:56:50 -0500
From: David_A._Fair@fc.mcps.k12.md.us (David A. Fair)
Subject: Re: Trigger Question
ghoyle1@airmail.net,Internet writes:
>When you use a power with Trigget, can this power be reused
>immediately, or
>do you have to wait until the trigger is set off?
I usually rule that the trigger must be activated before the power can
be "reset", though you could reuse it and have the first trigger
disappear...
>If it can be used before the trigger is set off, how do you keep people
>from
>having hundreds of precast attacks ready to go off?
Ummm, Genre Enforcement Police?
>If you have to trigger the power before it can be used again, how can
>you
>simulate things like potions, which can be made in multiple doses at a
>time,
>and which typically use triggers to activate them?
Try Charges.
Thanks,
Dave
- ---------------------------------------------------------
David A. Fair
Montgomery County Public Schools
Office of Global Access Technology
Elementary User Support Specialist
David_Fair@fc.mcps.k12.md.us
- ---------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 05:47:48 -0800 (PST)
From: shaw@caprica.com (Wayne Shaw)
Subject: Re: Bad Habits of Poor Gamers
>Pardon me while I shift the focus of this topic somewhat. I have a
>problem drawing a distinction between the two, not as a matter of game
>mechanics, but as a question of "realism." My definition of a Normal
>Attack is a narrow one. I see it as a low-velocity, bludgeoning
>attack against which a character's PD may reasonably be interpreted as
>offering some protection against the attack.
>
>I buy the notion of a muscular boxer being able to take a 4d6 punch
>better than a normal moke. But a 12 DC attack, capable of blowing a
>hole through a wall whether it's called a 12d6 EB or a 4d6 RKA? How
>does the boxer shrug that off? Once you're talking about attacks of
>such tremendous energy, then the distinction between Normal and
>Killing becomes meaningless. Any such attack, regardless of its
>nature, does Killing damage, and normal PD doesn't count for beans.
In the real world, perhaps. Unfortunately, at least in the superhero genre,
that is exactlyt he way some attacks...perhaps the majority of them...seem
to work. Bricks and energy projectors who can smash through walls
effortlessly hit other people (many of whom are not bulletproof) and at
worst injure them. A classic example of this is Spider-Man. Spider-Man has
been injured by bullets on at least two occasion I can think of. Yet he
takes hits from people who can tear through steel and doesn't die, or even
usually get seriously injured. The same is true of Captain America even
without the shield.
>So I would call any 12+ DC attack a KA. It's a rules change that
>makes the world more lethal, so any superhero with a CAK had better
>think twice before loosing the full force of his mightiest attack
>without knowing what the target can withstand.
It's also seriously counter-genre.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 06:03:02 -0800 (PST)
From: shaw@caprica.com (Wayne Shaw)
Subject: Re: Problems with Uncontrolled and Continuous (Attn: Steve Long)
>>>Um...the agents can probably ignore the fire....your average viper
>>agent takes
>>>a couple turns to go down from 1d6 KAs.
>
>Most people get shot once, maybe twice, and the fight is out of them.
>Not because they have lost too much BODY or too much STUN but because
>being shot tends to demoralize and take the fight out of all but the
>must fanatical of individuals. You may want to consider this fact when
>you play your NPC's: No one really knows how many BODY they have to
>begin with, nor how many they have left.
That would probably be rather less true if the people involved were trained
professionals used to running around in armor that made them incapable of
being seriously hurt by handgun fire, which is the case with most Viper agents.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 13:53:25 -0800 (PST)
From: John Desmarais <johndesmarais@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Gambit Write-up...
- ---Jorge Cadavid <cadavid@gate.net> wrote:
>
> Hey Guys, new to the list. Started playing Champions a few months
ago.
> Wanted to get some tips on making a character. The theme for the
> champions game I'm in is for mutants. Now from what I hear people
> usually play your basic bricks (hulk, jugger), or the EP (torch,
> iceman), or martial artists (wolverine). I wanted to make something
> slightly different and I went with guy no one has ever mentioned of
> playing before....Gambit!
> I thought to make him a martial artist/EP/thief/slight mentalist. The
> campaign is only 250 pts. Someone mentioned to me about getting the
> heromaker since I'm new. I was wondering if anyone might have a
copy of
> it online somewhere or on there webpage, where I might go to download
> it. Or if anyone might know where I can get it. Also if anyone hear
> might have a write-up for Gambit.
Heromaker is no longer available, but it's replacement, Creation
Workshop (or Hero Creator if all you want is the ability to make Hero
characters) is available from Hero Games or any game store that sells
Hero Games products.
Creation Workshop costs $30 and the Hero template for it costs $15
Hero Creator costs $25
Check out Hero Game web site (http://www.herogames.com) for more
information and some scren shots).
As for the write-up of Gambit, try
http://www.mactyre.net/scm/deejay/champs/writeups.html or
http://www.darkrealms.com/~antcrusher/gnborh.html
If it's on either site though it will probably be built on more than
250 points, but it would give you a starting point at least.
- -=>John Desmarais
http://www.sysabend.org/champions
p.s.
It's never a good idea to request to pirate software on a list
frequented by the folks who own the product (ie. Hero Games).
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
End of champ-l-digest V1 #148
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Date: Monday, May 24, 1999 03:13 PM