Digest Archives Vol 1 Issue 156
From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Sent: Saturday, January 23, 1999 2:58 PM
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #156
champ-l-digest Saturday, January 23 1999 Volume 01 : Number 156
In this issue:
Re: Hero Games website
Re: Character: Celeborn
Re: Hero Games website
Re: More Triggered Questions
Re: Batman's CAK (and long DC continuity rant)
Re: Character: Celeborn
RE: Hero Games website
Multipower and Entangle
Re: RE: Hero Games website
Charcter: Eomer
Re: Character: Celeborn
Re: Character: Celeborn
Re: Batman's CAK (and long DC continuity rant)
Re: Multipower and Entangle
Re: List Help
Re: Batman's CAK (and long DC continuity rant)
Re: Multipower and Entangle
Re: Multipower and Entangle
Re: Character: Celeborn
Re: Character: Goodgulf
Re: Character: Goodgulf
Caveat emptor
Re: Charcter: Eomer
Sigh: Elrond Note
Re: Charcter: Eomer
Levels and Limitations
test message
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 10:28:10 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Hero Games website
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
<snip talk about the HG website being down>
> I suggest announcing both here and on the Fuzion list (where this is
>also under discussion) when it's back in working order. :-]
Your suggestion is my command. Or something like that.
They're baaaack.
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 10:24:18 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Character: Celeborn
From: John P Weatherman <asahoshi@nr.infi.net>
>Michael Hayden mhayden@tsoft.com 1/21/99 10:13 PM
<snip>
>>Umm, in the Mirror scene, doesn't Galadriel also tell Frodo that the
>>second ring is with Elrond and that the third is "hidden"? It would
>>suggest that she knows Gandalf has it...
>
>Actually, sence she says outright who has Vilya her not saying Gandalf
>had (as he was "dead" at that point, anyway) Narya implies to me she
>didn't know...
Actually, to me it implies neither one. It could mean "Our enemies know
where Vilya is, so I can tell you", or it could mean, "I don't know where
Narya is", or it could mean a number of other things.
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 13:57:17 EST
From: HeroGames@aol.com
Subject: Re: Hero Games website
The Hero Games web site is back up! Hopefully there'll be no more
interruptions. Bruce will perform his update later today.
In related news, the last bureaucratic hurdle has been cleared, and therefore
our online store should be operational again in a few days! Then we'll be
pushing for making our e-products downloadable. When the store goes up, we'll
have at least one new product to offer, so stay tuned! We also have 4 or 5 new
products coming up in February, so keep checking our site. We'll be posting
info about the new products next week.
— Steve Peterson, Hero Games
------------------------------
Date: 22 Jan 1999 13:34:17 -0500
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: More Triggered Questions
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"LH" == Lisa Hartjes <beren@unforgettable.com> writes:
LH> Hmm.... Did what I just say make any sense to anyone but me? :)
Yeah. And like I said, Damage Shield is *NOT* Trigger. So, just ignore
everything about Trigger when it comes to Damage Shield.
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- --
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ Do not use Happy Fun Ball on concrete.
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 10:18:13 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Batman's CAK (and long DC continuity rant)
From: Steven J. Owens <puff@netcom.com>
>I wrote:
<snip>
> The realism isn't an attempt to force physics into comics, but
>rather keeping the social and psychological aspects of the situation
>realistic, sometimes by house rules (usually limiting power levels)
>and sometimes by roleplaying. For example, I like games where the
>power norms are kept within a sufficient range that normals with can
>be a significant threat. A heavy pistol (2d6+1 RKA) may not *kill*
>the hero but neither should it be negligible, particularly in the
>hands of an exceptional person (who might have Find Weakness).
A _very_ heavy pistol.:) 2d6+1 RKA cannot be found in an automatic, and only
a tiny handful of revolvers, as even a .44 Magnum only reaches 2d6. A .454
Casull is the only revolver I _know_ reaches those muzzle energies, which
appears to be what Hero Games bases their damage estimates on.
<snip>
> I think this is why I like playing superhero RPGs, plus perhaps
>the mythic aspects. Brin has said in forewords, etc, that most of his
>short work tends to be quite "mythic" in flavor (which is why The
>Postman, which started life as three novellas, had that aspect to it -
>the book was *much* better than the movie, I recommend it highly).
Absolutely. Brin's "The Postman" was a _good_ book, mangled into a _bad_
movie that only somewhat resembled the book. I recommend the book highly,
myself.
The only part I didn't like was when certain characters near the end of the
book did _something_ (I won't explain, that would give too much away), that
was inconsistent with basic mechanical physics. Since Brin is a physicist, I
found this disappointing. To be fair, though, it was the sort of thing an
engineer would spot more readily than a physicist.
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 10:46:10 -0800 (PST)
From: Michael Hayden <mhayden@tsoft.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Celeborn
On Fri, 22 Jan 1999, John P Weatherman wrote:
> >Umm, in the Mirror scene, doesn't Galadriel also tell Frodo that the
> >second ring is with Elrond and that the third is "hidden"? It would
> >suggest that she knows Gandalf has it...
>
> Actually, sence she says outright who has Vilya her not saying Gandalf
> had (as he was "dead" at that point, anyway) Narya implies to me she
> didn't know...
Ah, but Galadriel was also a precog/clairvoyant, via the Mirror. One of
Frodo's own visions was apparently of Gandalf wandering near Fangorn
before he met up with Gimli, Legolas, and Aragorn.
We could just as easily guess that as soon as the Fellowship delivered the
news to Galadriel and Celeborn, Galadriel went to the Mirror and used it
to find out Gandalf's ultimate fate. Think about it -- of all the
Fellowship, only Aragorn really understood that Gandalf and the Balrog
were both Maiar, but he was so torn up by his apparent failure as a leader
that he couldn't keep the story straight. Galadriel heard the news and
figured, "Hey, Gandalf can't be beaten that easily. Maybe he survived the
battle." Poof, off she went to her Mirror...
As for Galadriel's motivation to not tell the Fellowship that Gandalf
might have survived? Easy -- the Fellowship would want to wait in Lorien
for Gandalf to come out of Moria and be healed. Galadriel knew the
Fellowship couldn't afford that kind of delay, so she sent them on,
content in her own mind that Gandalf would catch up to them when needed.
Bah, this is all a huge tangent. Long story short: I think that as a
clairvoyant and as a fellow ringbearer, Galadriel knew Gandalf had Narya.
In telling Frodo only that the third ring was "hidden," she was simply
hedging her bets on if/when/how Gandalf would make it out of Moria.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Michael D. Hayden -- mhayden@silverhammer.org -- http://silverhammer.org/
Hey, I use Procmail with Spam Bouncer, so spam away! (^_^)
"What you are about to see is real. These are not actors; they're directors."
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 14:10:35 -0500
From: Brian Wawrow <bwawrow@mondello.toronto.fmco.com>
Subject: RE: Hero Games website
Any word on when the on-line store will be activated [8 or less] again? I've
been entirely unsuccessful putting my hands on a copy of Broken Kingdoms.
I've never had such a hard time parting with cash before. The up side is
that the exchange rate I get on the U.S. dollar is getting better every day.
:|
] > I suggest announcing both here and on the Fuzion list
] (where this is
] >also under discussion) when it's back in working order. :-]
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 11:30:16 -0800
From: Kirk Lund <klund@technologist.com>
Subject: Multipower and Entangle
Question: Say a speedster has Entangle, "Only with items in the
envirnoment" placed into a Multipower of speedy-things-he-can-do.
He uses this to entangle opponents with things like spare tires, trash
cans, rope, cable, anything he can find. If he switches to a different
slot to use, say, Missile Deflection or his Super-Noogie attack,
does this Entangle automatically go down?
(I could've sworn this came up on the list recently, but can't find the
posts in my mailbox.)
- --Kirk
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 14:52:22 EST
From: HeroGames@aol.com
Subject: Re: RE: Hero Games website
In a message dated 1/22/99 11:38:14 AM, bwawrow@mondello.toronto.fmco.com
writes:
>Any word on when the on-line store will be activated [8 or less] again?
>I've been entirely unsuccessful putting my hands on a copy of Broken
Kingdoms.
>
The online store could be operational as early as Monday; it just depends on
how fast things move from point A to point B, and get implemented by someone.
I'd suspect Tuesday or Wednesday as more likely, though.
— Steve Peterson, Hero Games
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 14:49:07 -0500
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Charcter: Eomer
EOMER, THIRD MARSHALL OF THE RIDDERMARK
15 STR 5
16 DEX 18
18 CON 16
16 BODY 12
15 INT 5
20 EGO 20
18 PRE 8
14 COM 2
8 PD 5
6 ED 2
4 SPD 14
10 REC 6
46 END 5
55 STUN 27
Characteristics Cost: 145
5 WF,Lances,Common Melee,Common Missile
32 4 Levels,all combat
10 2 Levels: Mounted Combat,related group
10 1 Levels,all skills
11 Animal Handler 15-
3 High Society 13 -
9 Navigation 14-
5 Oratory 14-
17 Riding 19-
13 Survival 16-
9 Tactics 15-
9 Tracking 15-
3 Bump Of Direction
7 14- Fast Draw
5 1D6 Luck
4 +2" Running
1 Lang: Rohirric,native,literacy
4 Lang: Westron,fluent w/accent,literacy
8 AK: Rohan 17-
3 AK: Anorien 12-
4 KS: Eothraim History 13-
5 KS: Rohan Politics 14-
3 KS: Orc Tribes 12-
5 14- Contact: Theoden
4 13- Contact: Marshals of Rohan
2 11- Contact: Gandalf
75 2,000 100-point Followers (The Eastern Riddermark)
5 Member of Aristocracy
5 Money
Powers Cost: 276
Total Cost: 421
Base Points: 75
13 Watched,"By Theoden",more powerful,noncombat influence,
harsh,appear 11-
10 Watched,"Saruman",more powerful,noncombat influence,harsh,
appear 8-
5 Watched,"Grima Wormtongue",less powerful,noncombat
influence,harsh,appear 8-
15 Psychological Limitation,"Loyal to Theoden",common,strong
10 Psychological Limitation,"Protective of Eowyn",common,
moderate
15 Psychological Limitation,"Hatred of Orcs",common,strong
10 Public ID,"Third Marshall of the Riddermark"
10 Reputation,"Great Leader",occur 11-
258 Bonus
Disadvantages Total: 346
Experience Spent: 0
Total Points: 421
Eomer, son of Eomund, is the nephew of King Theoden of Rohan,
and one of his warleaders. The evil counsel of Grima turned Theoden's
heart against his nephew, and so Eomer was not welcome in the halls
of Edoras. Despite that, he remained faithful to his king and his country,
and occasionally received the wise counsel of Gandalf.
During the War of the Ring, Eomer fought heroically at the Hornburg,
the Pelennor Fields and the Morannon and became fast friends with
Aragorn. As Theoden lay dying on the Pelennor Fields, he named
Eomer his heir and successor, and so Eomer became the eighteenth
king of Rohan.
In Third Age 3020, he married Lothiriel of Dol Amroth and together they
had one child, Elfwine the Fair. Eomer also renewed the Oath of Eorl
with Aragorn (now King Elessar) and fought beside him in Harad and Rhun
into the Fourth Age. Eomer was born in Third Age 2991, was twenty-eight
at the time of the war of the ring, and died in Fourth Age 63 at the age of
ninety-three.
NOTES:
1)The "harsh" notation under the "Watched by Theoden" disadvantage
is because of Grima's evil counsel. Eomer was close to being jailed
for treason.
2) Eowyn is -not- a DNPC because as a "less powerful", "useful skills"
she would be worth no points. Moreover, Eowyn can take care of herself!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"He has honor if he holds himself to an ideal
of conduct though it is inconvenient, unprofitable,
or dangerous to do so."
Walter Lippmann, A Preface to Morals
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott C. Nolan
nolan@erols.com
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 12:09:49 -0800
From: Scott Bennie <sbennie@dowco.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Celeborn
Agreed on all accounts. Galadriel was the symbolic equivalent for the Third Age
that Melian was for the First Age, just as Lothlorien has many of the same
properties that Doriath had in the First Age (magically hard to reach, sanctuary of
the Wood Elves ruled by High Elves); it's hard to underestimate her power and
knowledge. Even before Tolkien raised Galadriel to the equal of Feanor (as he did
in his later writings, when he also removed her from the status of rebel against
the Valar), she was the oldest of the elven lords still in Middle-earth, and as
granddaughter of Finwe, sister of Finrod (the most sympathetic of all elven lords
in the Silmarillion), and Melian's pupil, had a status that no one else had in
Middle-earth. Her skeptical reaction to Gandalf's death, and her role as the first
person in Middle-earth to whom Gandalf turned after his return (IIRC) convinces me
that it would be unlikely that she *wouldn't* know the disposition of all elven
rings. And we thought the Balrog was controversial...
But Scott hasn't hit the "G"s yet.
Scott Bennie
Michael Hayden wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Jan 1999, John P Weatherman wrote:
>
> > >Umm, in the Mirror scene, doesn't Galadriel also tell Frodo that the
> > >second ring is with Elrond and that the third is "hidden"? It would
> > >suggest that she knows Gandalf has it...
> >
> > Actually, sence she says outright who has Vilya her not saying Gandalf
> > had (as he was "dead" at that point, anyway) Narya implies to me she
> > didn't know...
>
> Ah, but Galadriel was also a precog/clairvoyant, via the Mirror. One of
> Frodo's own visions was apparently of Gandalf wandering near Fangorn
> before he met up with Gimli, Legolas, and Aragorn.
>
> We could just as easily guess that as soon as the Fellowship delivered the
> news to Galadriel and Celeborn, Galadriel went to the Mirror and used it
> to find out Gandalf's ultimate fate. Think about it -- of all the
> Fellowship, only Aragorn really understood that Gandalf and the Balrog
> were both Maiar, but he was so torn up by his apparent failure as a leader
> that he couldn't keep the story straight. Galadriel heard the news and
> figured, "Hey, Gandalf can't be beaten that easily. Maybe he survived the
> battle." Poof, off she went to her Mirror...
>
> As for Galadriel's motivation to not tell the Fellowship that Gandalf
> might have survived? Easy -- the Fellowship would want to wait in Lorien
> for Gandalf to come out of Moria and be healed. Galadriel knew the
> Fellowship couldn't afford that kind of delay, so she sent them on,
> content in her own mind that Gandalf would catch up to them when needed.
>
> Bah, this is all a huge tangent. Long story short: I think that as a
> clairvoyant and as a fellow ringbearer, Galadriel knew Gandalf had Narya.
> In telling Frodo only that the third ring was "hidden," she was simply
> hedging her bets on if/when/how Gandalf would make it out of Moria.
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Michael D. Hayden -- mhayden@silverhammer.org -- http://silverhammer.org/
> Hey, I use Procmail with Spam Bouncer, so spam away! (^_^)
> "What you are about to see is real. These are not actors; they're directors."
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 15:53:58 -0500
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Celeborn
At 12:09 PM 1/22/99 -0800, Scott Bennie wrote:
>Middle-earth. Her skeptical reaction to Gandalf's death, and her role as the
first
>person in Middle-earth to whom Gandalf turned after his return (IIRC)
convinces me
>that it would be unlikely that she *wouldn't* know the disposition of all
elven
>rings. And we thought the Balrog was controversial...
>
>But Scott hasn't hit the "G"s yet.
And now I'm scared...
I'll be doing two versions of Gandalf, BTW. The Grey and the White.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"He has honor if he holds himself to an ideal
of conduct though it is inconvenient, unprofitable,
or dangerous to do so."
Walter Lippmann, A Preface to Morals
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott C. Nolan
nolan@erols.com
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 16:34:22 -0500 (EST)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: Batman's CAK (and long DC continuity rant)
On Fri, 22 Jan 1999, Filksinger wrote:
> From: Steven J. Owens <puff@netcom.com>
> > The realism isn't an attempt to force physics into comics, but
> >rather keeping the social and psychological aspects of the situation
> >realistic, sometimes by house rules (usually limiting power levels)
> >and sometimes by roleplaying. For example, I like games where the
> >power norms are kept within a sufficient range that normals with can
> >be a significant threat. A heavy pistol (2d6+1 RKA) may not *kill*
> >the hero but neither should it be negligible, particularly in the
> >hands of an exceptional person (who might have Find Weakness).
>
> A _very_ heavy pistol.:) 2d6+1 RKA cannot be found in an automatic, and only
> a tiny handful of revolvers, as even a .44 Magnum only reaches 2d6. A .454
> Casull is the only revolver I _know_ reaches those muzzle energies, which
> appears to be what Hero Games bases their damage estimates on.
Actually, 2d6+1 RKA is used for an automatic pistol, the IMI Desert Eagle
.50. The .454 Casull is the only revolver I know of that is written up as
a 2d6+1 RKA.
- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html
"What would you do with a brain if you *had* one?"
Dorothy (Judy Garland), from _The Wizard of Oz_
------------------------------
Date: 22 Jan 1999 16:55:32 -0500
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: Multipower and Entangle
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"KL" == Kirk Lund <klund@technologist.com> writes:
KL> If he switches to a different slot to use, say, Missile Deflection or
KL> his Super-Noogie attack, does this Entangle automatically go down?
No. Entangle creates a permanent object. It does not go away until it is
destroyed. If you want/need a similar power that goes away, try using
Telekenesis instead.
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- --
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ If Happy Fun Ball begins to smoke, get
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ away immediately. Seek shelter and cover
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ head.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 16:50:32 -0500
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Re: List Help
At 01:43 PM 1/22/99 -0800, you wrote:
>On Fri, 22 Jan 1999 Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com> wrote:
>
>>I want to thank the list for all the support and comments
>>I've received in writing up Tolkien's characters. I read and
>>consider every post, and will be making many of the suggested
>>improvements in the final drafts, which I plan to post on my
>>website when I am all through.
>
>On that note, where exactly is your website? I'll be wanting to keep an
>eye out for the final drafts. I'm always interested in character
>writeups. Good work so far...
Thank you. None of these writeups (or any others) are on the site
yet. That can wait until I'm finished. But the site is at:
http://www.erols.com/nolan
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"He has honor if he holds himself to an ideal
of conduct though it is inconvenient, unprofitable,
or dangerous to do so."
Walter Lippmann, A Preface to Morals
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott C. Nolan
nolan@erols.com
------------------------------
Date: 22 Jan 1999 17:24:56 -0500
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: Batman's CAK (and long DC continuity rant)
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"MS" == Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com> writes:
MS> Actually, 2d6+1 RKA is used for an automatic pistol, the IMI Desert
MS> Eagle .50. The .454 Casull is the only revolver I know of that is
MS> written up as a 2d6+1 RKA.
That would be because .454 Casul is >< more powerful than .50 Magnum. They
are considered comparable loads.
And please do not confuse .50 Mag with .50 Browning, which is way more
powerful than either handgun load.
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- --
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ Warning: pregnant women, the elderly, and
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ children under 10 should avoid prolonged
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ exposure to Happy Fun Ball.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 14:11:27 -0800
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Multipower and Entangle
At 11:30 AM 1/22/99 -0800, Kirk Lund wrote:
>Question: Say a speedster has Entangle, "Only with items in the
>envirnoment" placed into a Multipower of speedy-things-he-can-do.
>He uses this to entangle opponents with things like spare tires, trash
>cans, rope, cable, anything he can find. If he switches to a different
>slot to use, say, Missile Deflection or his Super-Noogie attack,
>does this Entangle automatically go down?
Nope. There's no logical reason for it to.
The only Power this seems to apply to is Aid, and personally I think
this should be done with a Limitation rather than a default condition.
>(I could've sworn this came up on the list recently, but can't find the
>posts in my mailbox.)
Perhaps a similar discussion came up, but I never saw it (though a
couple of discussions got kinda strange, and I skipped them, so it's hard
to tell).
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 07:34:25 -0800 (PST)
From: shaw@caprica.com (Wayne Shaw)
Subject: Re: Multipower and Entangle
>Question: Say a speedster has Entangle, "Only with items in the
>envirnoment" placed into a Multipower of speedy-things-he-can-do.
>He uses this to entangle opponents with things like spare tires, trash
>cans, rope, cable, anything he can find. If he switches to a different
>slot to use, say, Missile Deflection or his Super-Noogie attack,
>does this Entangle automatically go down?
>
>(I could've sworn this came up on the list recently, but can't find the
>posts in my mailbox.)
No. Entangle is an instant power with an ongoing effect, just like most
other attack powers. The only place where this logic is somewhat ignored in
the rules is the benign end of the effect of Adjustment powers, because the
consequences of not doing so would be too horrible to contemplate.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 15:39:09 -0800 (PST)
From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Celeborn
this is a great discussion. sigh.
if only it could be on the FH list.
(not a flame, just the FH list begs for this...)
==
=========================== Elliott aka The Egyptoid ==
=== JLA: Justice League Alabama === Central HQ ===========
=== http://www.sysabend.org/champions/elliott/index.html =
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 15:35:18 -0800 (PST)
From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Goodgulf
>MBh, this is all ory short: I thnk that as a
>claioyant Galarel knew Gadalf had Nya.
>In telng Fro g was "hiddn" she was smply
>hging her be uld make it out of Mria.
Galadwrap hid the ring because of certain intimate
personal favors she owed Goodgulf. Had Frito learned
of her Magic Ring, he would've ran to Gulfie like a
wino with a $20 pawn ticket and sold her out, man.
Consider everything else Frito knew about the Rings,
Sorhed, the plottings of Serutan and the land of Gonad:
That knowledge and two farthings will get you a cup
of hot java in downtown Minas Troney...
==
=========================== Elliott aka The Egyptoid ==
=== JLA: Justice League Alabama === Central HQ ===========
=== http://www.sysabend.org/champions/elliott/index.html =
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 17:09:13 -0800 (PST)
From: Michael Hayden <mhayden@tsoft.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Goodgulf
On Fri, 22 Jan 1999, Ell Egyptoid wrote:
> Galadwrap hid the ring because of certain intimate
> personal favors she owed Goodgulf. Had Frito learned
> of her Magic Ring, he would've ran to Gulfie like a
> wino with a $20 pawn ticket and sold her out, man.
>
> Consider everything else Frito knew about the Rings,
> Sorhed, the plottings of Serutan and the land of Gonad:
> That knowledge and two farthings will get you a cup
> of hot java in downtown Minas Troney...
Ah, so you've read "Bored of the Rings" too...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Michael D. Hayden -- mhayden@silverhammer.org -- http://silverhammer.org/
Hey, I use Procmail with Spam Bouncer, so spam away! (^_^)
"What you are about to see is real. These are not actors; they're directors."
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 21:05:33 -0600
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net>
Subject: Caveat emptor
As part of a recent discussion on 1st through 4th editions of Champions,
Steve Peterson was good enough to provide specific descriptions of each
one. He noted at the time that Hero Games still had some copies of 1st
edition (not first printing, but 1st edition) available for sale. Based on
these descriptions --
"BTW, just to clear up the historical record: The first edition of Champions
was a 4-color cover (predominantly blue!) book, 64 pages long, for $10. (You
can still pick up copies of the second printing of this book; see the order
form on our web site. We have a few left for the collectors...) The second
edition was a boxed set with the same cover..."
- -- and on a close examination of my own books, I decided that my earliest
book was 2nd edition. I decided to indulge myself in a frivolous addition
to the collection and spend $10 to buy a 1st edition copy.
I didn't get one.
Instead of the 64-page book described above, I was sent an 80-page book
clearly marked 2nd edition. I already own this book; in fact both the copy
I already had, and the one I received today, are from the Fourth Printing
of the 2nd Edition. It kind of feels like I wasted $10, though the new
copy is of course in pristine shape, something that cannot be said of my
earlier copy.
I wrote Hero Games about it, and received a reply within a couple of hours.
I don't know *who* replied (it was just signed "Hero Games"), but whoever
it was apologized and agreed to update the Hero Plus orderform to reflect
what was actually available. No offer could be made to replace the 2nd
edition book I'd received with the 1st edition book I'd ordered, because
they do not in fact have any 1st edition books.
Steve Peterson's claim that they did was backed up by the online orderform,
and I don't blame him personally for the mix-up...unless, of course, he is
solely responsible for both maintaining the product inventory and for
editing the online orderform, in which case: Bad Steve! Bad Steve! :)
Hero Games is *not* a bad retailer, and I do *not* want to discourage
anyone from ordering from them. But for those few items where there could
be some ambiguity in what's being ordered -- to avoid disappointments, ask
first.
Damon
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 23:56:29 EST
From: Leah L Watts <llwatts@juno.com>
Subject: Re: Charcter: Eomer
>5 14- Contact: Theoden
>4 13- Contact: Marshals of Rohan
>2 11- Contact: Gandalf
How about a Contact with Aragorn as well? They became friends pretty
rapidly, IIRC.
Leah
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------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 00:51:19 -0500
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Sigh: Elrond Note
Another error. In the Second Draft, I meant for the ring, Vilya,
to have 15d6 of Aid, at a cost of 10 points per die, not 30d6
at a cost of 5 per.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"He has honor if he holds himself to an ideal
of conduct though it is inconvenient, unprofitable,
or dangerous to do so."
Walter Lippmann, A Preface to Morals
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott C. Nolan
nolan@erols.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 00:49:54 -0500
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Re: Charcter: Eomer
At 11:56 PM 1/22/99 -0500, you wrote:
>>5 14- Contact: Theoden
>>4 13- Contact: Marshals of Rohan
>>2 11- Contact: Gandalf
>
>How about a Contact with Aragorn as well? They became friends pretty
>rapidly, IIRC.
But only toward the end of the War of the Ring. Any time after late 3019, I
would agree with you. I have attempted to model the character more or less
at the point where he met the Three Walkers.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"He has honor if he holds himself to an ideal
of conduct though it is inconvenient, unprofitable,
or dangerous to do so."
Walter Lippmann, A Preface to Morals
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott C. Nolan
nolan@erols.com
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 00:37:34 EST
From: ErolB1@aol.com
Subject: Levels and Limitations
In one of the Middle Earth writeups, someone mentioned that only 5-point and
higher Levels could be bought with Limitations. This is 'by the book' for 4th
ed - but it's something I'd like to see changed in 5th ed.
As GM, I allow Limiations on 2- and 3-point levels as long as at least five
points worth of levels are packaged together. For example, if a player buys a
blaster rifle with two 3-point levels, I'll allow a Focus Limitation applied
to the 6 points.
I've also slightly redefined the different levels of Levels to work out what I
see as a kink in the progression and to eliminate the concept of the 'tight
group.' IMHO the 'tight group' requires too many judgment calls and is too
vulnerable to abuse.
The way I define Levels are:
2-pt: Can only be used as a +1 'fixed' Level with a single attack. It will
almost always be a +1 OCV, but can be defined as a +1 DCV if the conception
really really calls for it.
3-pt: Can be used either as a 'flexible' Level (applied to OCV, DCV or extra
damage) with a single attack, *or* as a 'fixed' level with a group of related
attacks (a set of maneuvers in a martial art, the set of powers in a
Multipower, etc.) If used as a 'fixed' level, it will usually be defined +1
OCV, but may be defined as a +1 DCV with a good conception (e.g. a 'Crazed
Weasel' martial art might take one or more +1 DCV levels with all its
maneuvers to represent the emphasis on not getting hit.)
5-pt: Can be used either as a 'flexible' Level with a group of related
attacks, *or* as a 'fixed' Level with all combat. If used as a 'fixed' Level,
it will usually be defined as +1 DCV with all combat. [I don't use the split
between 'hand to hand combat' and 'ranged combat' with this. It's officially
listed as an optional rule in the BBB, and as GM I officially option it *out*
of my games.]
8-pt: A 'flexible' Level with all combat, as described in the BBB.
Erol K. Bayburt
Evil Genius for a Better Tomorrow
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 14:32:26 EST
From: DVBaum@aol.com
Subject: test message
This is only a test
------------------------------
End of champ-l-digest V1 #156
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