Digest Archives Vol 1 Issue 165
From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 1999 8:31 PM
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #165
champ-l-digest Wednesday, January 27 1999 Volume 01 : Number 165
In this issue:
No Conscious Control
Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
Re: AP, Penetrating, Piercing
Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
Re: Multipower Questions
Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
Re: No Conscious Control
Re: How much damage should guns do.
Re: My thought on guns after your comments
Re: No Conscious Control
Champs Web page
Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
Re: How much damage should guns do.
Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
RE: Character: Frodo Baggins
Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
Re: How much damage should guns do.
Character ideas needed: sci-fi hacker
Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
Re: How much damage should guns do.
Re: Champs Web page
Re: AP, Penetrating, Piercing
Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
Re: How much damage should guns do.
Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
Re: No Conscious Control
Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
Re: Character ideas needed: sci-fi hacker
Re: Champs Web page
Re: My thought on guns after your comments
Re: Hobbit Missile Bonus
Re: Character ideas needed: sci-fi hacker
Tolkien Characters (was: Frodo Baggins)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 15:57:53 +0900
From: Michael House <macross@gol.com>
Subject: No Conscious Control
I got into a discussion with someone a while back about No Conscious
Control. To make a long story short, he said that he played it in such a
way that powers with this limitation went off at inopportune times for
the character, as well as times when it be useful to the character,
because he said it wasn't a limitation otherwise. An example he gave
was an EB bought this way might go off while the character was
asleep, or something similar.
I read and re-read the description of the limitation (in HSR), and couldn't
find anything that supported this interpretation. I've never used it this
way, and I can't remember ever playing with anyone who did, either.
If possible, I'd like an official ruling, if Mr. Peterson or anyone else in a
position to do so would be so kind. Thanks for your time.
Be Seeing You...
Michael House, macross@gol.com
Opinions expressed herein are my own unless otherwise specified.
"Perfection is achieved only by institutions on the point of collapse."
- --C. Northcote Parkinson
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 10:43:34 EST
From: Leah L Watts <llwatts@juno.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
>OBHero: IIRC, hobbits/halflings get a bonus with ranged combat/missile
>weapons. I don't remember any reference to this with Frodo.
I know hobbits were very good with missile weapons (including thrown
stones), but that may just have been from their high DEX.
___________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 10:43:35 EST
From: Leah L Watts <llwatts@juno.com>
Subject: Re: AP, Penetrating, Piercing
>>>something like the old Piercing advantage from Champions III.
>
>How does this work,as opposed to AP or Penetrating?
AP: halves the defenses of the target.
Penetrating: no matter how high the target's defenses are, something's
gonna get through.
Piercing: (hopefully I have all the errata notes for that section)
subtracts from the target's defenses. i.e. if a target with 20 ED gets
hit with an energy attack with, say, 6 Piercing points, it's treated like
he only has a 14 ED (20 - the 6 Piercing points). OTOH, if the target
only had an ED of 5, he's effectively defenseless against that attack and
will probably need an ambulance soon. There's a warning note on Piercing
since it tends to make combat against low-DEF characters bloody.
Leah
___________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 11:27:31 -0500
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
At 10:43 AM 1/27/99 -0500, you wrote:
>>OBHero: IIRC, hobbits/halflings get a bonus with ranged combat/missile
>>weapons. I don't remember any reference to this with Frodo.
>
>I know hobbits were very good with missile weapons (including thrown
>stones), but that may just have been from their high DEX.
The "bonus with missiles" comes from Dungeons and Dragons.
There is no reference to it in any of Tolkien's writings, I believe.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"It yearns me not if men my garments wear;
Such outward things dwell not in my desire:
But if it be a sin to covet honour,
I am the most offending soul alive."
William Shakespeare, Henry V
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott C. Nolan
nolan@erols.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 10:39:09 -0600 (CST)
From: gilberg@ou.edu
Subject: Re: Multipower Questions
>> Multipower #1 is basically just a bunch of gadgets with OAF and 4 charges for
>> each slot limitation. My question on that one is: Can I take the OAF(-1) and
>> 4 charges(-1) limitation on the main multipower cost? I know that I can take
>> the OAF limitation, but I'm not sure about the 4 charges limitation
>>
>> exp. 17 Multpower 50 pts., "Toy-Gadgets", OAF(-1), 4 charges each
slot(-1)
>
>4 Charges on the Reserve and on each slot would mean that the reserve
>could be used only 4 times before recharging. An appropriate SFX for
>this would be a multi-function blaster, powered by a clip of single-use
>power cells, each good for one shot.
Er, no. We were just discussing this. The reserve gets the common
limitations of each slot, in this case, 4 charges per slot. While a good
potential house rule, that construction was quite valid by the book.
-Tim Gilberg
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 08:57:55 -0800 (PST)
From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
> The "bonus with missiles" comes from Dungeons and Dragons.
Isn't there a reference to a unit of hobbit archers that
fought in an old war in Arnor? Like in the appendix of
Return of the King? I had always assumed the dex/missile
bonus idea had been extrapolated from that.
==
=========================== Elliott aka The Egyptoid ==
=== JLA: Justice League Alabama === Central HQ ===========
=== http://www.sysabend.org/champions/elliott/index.html =
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 11:35:24 -0500
From: Mike Christodoulou <Cypriot@concentric.net>
Subject: Re: No Conscious Control
At 03:57 PM 1/27/99 +0900, Michael House wrote:
>I got into a discussion with someone a while back about No Conscious
>Control. To make a long story short, he said that he played it in such a
>way that powers with this limitation went off at inopportune times for
>the character, as well as times when it be useful to the character,
>because he said it wasn't a limitation otherwise.
Sorry ... I can't offer an official position. But for what it's worth,
I'd have to agree with your player.
No Conscious Control is a power that is not controlled by the player,
but is subject to the whims of the GM, usually where it will help
the plot. A cruel GM could use this to get the player into trouble,
although one would hope that this doesn't happen too often.
I don't know that I'd ever take the limitation on an EB. It's more
useful for the "stop sign" powers such as Clairsentience, in which a
possibly overbalancing power is mitigated by allowing the GM to
control its use.
====================== =================================================
Mike Christodoulou "Never doubt that a small group of committed
Cypriot@Concentric.Net citizens can change the world. In fact, it is
(770) 662-5605 the only thing that ever has." -- Margaret Mead
====================== =================================================
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 08:59:00 -0800 (PST)
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
Subject: Re: How much damage should guns do.
Filksinger writes:
>
> Actually, there was physics involved, I'm sure. There was a book produced
> once called "The Armory" which contained the stats for hundreds of
> real-world guns. Not only did it carry the HERO stats, but also real-world
> characteristics, including muzzle energy. Hero Games stats matched the
> Armory precisely in virtually all cases, and a moderately thorough check of
> DCs vs muzzle energy showed that the Armory stats _were_ entirely
> calculated by muzzle energy, and assumed that doubling muzzle energy added
> one DC.
Hm...fascinating. So how exactly do you explain that the .44 magnum (typical
muzzle energy around 1400 joules) does dramatically more damage (2d6 w/+1 stun
mod vs 2d-1 with a normal stun mod) than a .223 rifle (typical muzzle energy
around 1800 joules).
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 09:36:12 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: My thought on guns after your comments
From: Max Callahan <mcallahan@home.com>
<snip>
>
>So what does every body think about:
> Light Armor piercing, +1/4 Advantage, the attack goes against 3/4
>of the targets defense.
>And then apply that to all rifles.
Not bad, but I wouldn't use it with _all_ rifles. Only the medium and high
powered ones using full-metal jacket ammo.
>Oh and I've been buying 3 round burst as a 1/2 advantage (same as 5 round
>autofire) as the disadvantage of not geting the fourth and fith hit is
>about equal to the advantage of not wasting 2 rounds of ammo that you will
>seldom hit with.
Only problem is, with the present rules, an ordinary Autofire weapon can
fire any number of rounds desired, up to a maximum of 5. Thus, if you think
firing only 3 is better, just fire 3.
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 11:49:25 -0500
From: Kim Foster <nexus@uky.campus.mci.net>
Subject: Re: No Conscious Control
At 03:57 PM 1/27/99 +0900, Michael House wrote:
>I got into a discussion with someone a while back about No Conscious
>Control. To make a long story short, he said that he played it in such a
>way that powers with this limitation went off at inopportune times for
>the character, as well as times when it be useful to the character,
>because he said it wasn't a limitation otherwise. An example he gave
>was an EB bought this way might go off while the character was
>asleep, or something similar.
>
>I read and re-read the description of the limitation (in HSR), and couldn't
>find anything that supported this interpretation. I've never used it this
>way, and I can't remember ever playing with anyone who did, either.
>If possible, I'd like an official ruling, if Mr. Peterson or anyone else in a
>position to do so would be so kind. Thanks for your time.
As the person who runs the limit that way, I'd like to add some
clarification. I didn't say it wasn't a limitation, I said if you wanted a
pawer that would only activate in circumstances when it was benfical, just
not dependably, Activation worked better. I ran no consious control powers
as the PC had -no- control over when it goes off. It might go off an
inopportune or neutral time as well as not at all when its useful. If you
want a power that rarely goes off when its useful, I feel activation roll
handles this better, just call the "lack of conscious control" a sfx. I
interpret a power with NCC as totally in the GMs hands as to if and when it
goes off, practically making it a plot device. To continus the Energy Blast
example, does the EB go off randomly (and if so, wha6t does it target? Is it
a 0 phase action? Just a thought) or does the character go around pointing
his finger (or whatever) and sometimes he fires an EB, sometimes not. The
second sounds a lot more like Activation.
No Consious Control is a hefty limitation. "The power only turns on when the
GM chooses-usually when it furthers the adventure". To me that implies it
can turn when it doesn't further the adventure, hampers the character or for
no reason other than flavor. EX:A NCC precog power kicks in and gives an
image of an interesting, but unimportant to the mission at hand, future or a
NCC electrical blast kicks in a low level and shocks someone touching the
charcter or shorts something out.
Oh! Its all hot and sticky.
Is this blood? Nice....
Lillith-Darkstalkers 3
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 09:36:10 -0800
From: "Raven" <raven@neteze.com>
Subject: Champs Web page
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
- ------=_NextPart_000_0034_01BE49D8.7932F9A0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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Is it just me or is there page down again?
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<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.3612.1700"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Is it just me or is there page down=20
again?</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 12:48:12 -0500
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
At 08:57 AM 1/27/99 -0800, you wrote:
>> The "bonus with missiles" comes from Dungeons and Dragons.
>
>Isn't there a reference to a unit of hobbit archers that
>fought in an old war in Arnor? Like in the appendix of
>Return of the King? I had always assumed the dex/missile
>bonus idea had been extrapolated from that.
In Arthedain, actually. Arnor had fallen by that time. It
probably is a result of that line that D&D hobbits have
their archery abilities. But is thin evidence forwhat I'm
trying to do here, which is recreate the characters seen
in the Lord of the Rings. None of the hobbits seen there
exhibit anything beyond a mere weapon familiarity.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"It yearns me not if men my garments wear;
Such outward things dwell not in my desire:
But if it be a sin to covet honour,
I am the most offending soul alive."
William Shakespeare, Henry V
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott C. Nolan
nolan@erols.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 09:57:17 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: How much damage should guns do.
From: qts <qts@nildram.co.uk>
>On Mon, 25 Jan 1999 08:33:56 -0800, Christopher Taylor wrote:
>
<snip>
>>Not really, while a rifle does have longer range and greater accuracy at
>>range, the bullets in a pisol and rifle are not the same. the actual led
>>ball is the same, but the cartrige has more powder and thus greater power
>>and muzzel velocity. This translates into more energy and more damage.
>>Thats why a 22 pistol is much less damaging than an M16 even though the
>>actual hunk of lead is very similar in size (.22 vs .223)
>
>Not at very short range.
Yes, at very short range. It is not uncommon for a man shot with a .22 full
in the torso to ignore it and keep on coming. It is rare for a man hit with
a .223 to do so. Much greater damage.
>And remember that the volume of the hunk goes
>with the cube, so it's 27% (1.03^3) more effective.
That increases the volume and mass, but not the surface area where it hits.
And the surface area matters more than the mass, in general.
Additionally, a .223 is much longer than a .22 round. This is particularly
important when you realize that the .223 tumbles upon impact, carving a
twisted channel through its target. While it generally goes fairly straight,
it is not unknown for a man hit from the front in the upper chest to have
the exit wound in the thigh. The tumbling of the extra long bullet causes a
.223 to have an effectively much higher surface area, as well as the effects
of having the bullet twist and jump around in you as it goes through.
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 10:11:34 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
>FRODO OF THE NINE-FINGERS, RING-BEARER
<snip>
>18 EGO 16
<snip>
>6) The One Ring is over 1200 Active Points. The massive Aid will work
>for anyone with a magical VPP. Yes, the Ring promised power to
>Sam, Boromir and Frodo, but surprise, it was lying. Look what it did for
>Smeagol: turned him into Gollum.
I disagree completely. Frodo, IMO, was being offered _real_ power.
The Ring offered Smeagol nothing. It needed to offer nothing; the lure of
gold was sufficient to attract him and drive him to murder, and its minor
ability to create invisibility enough to hold him firm. Frodo required more.
The nature of magic in Middle Earth, combined with a general impression
throughout the books, gives me to believe that the Ring could be forced to
obey and grant power to a greater and greater degree, the greater your will.
Thus, the stronger your will, the more that you could force the Ring to do.
If you were strong enough, you could force the Ring to grant you its full
power outright. It was this offer of _actual_ power, power great enough to
defeat Sauron, force the Ring to do great things, and rule Middle Earth,
that eventually corrupted Frodo.
This knowledge is what gave it its influence even over people like Gandalf,
who was powerfully tempted to take it up, yet in all the books dared touch
it only for an instant, just once. He knew he could force the Ring to obey
him by his will; it would grant _him_ power, no doubt about it, and he could
make it do whatever he said. He could even use it to defeat Sauron and do
great and wonderful things. However, once anyone gave in, they were trapped
by the Ring; it would give them the power, but inevitably corrupt them. In
the end, if it wasn't owned by Sauron, it might as well have been.
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 13:48:39 -0500
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
At 10:11 AM 1/27/99 -0800, you wrote:
>From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
>
>
>>FRODO OF THE NINE-FINGERS, RING-BEARER
><snip>
>>18 EGO 16
><snip>
>>6) The One Ring is over 1200 Active Points. The massive Aid will work
>>for anyone with a magical VPP. Yes, the Ring promised power to
>>Sam, Boromir and Frodo, but surprise, it was lying. Look what it did for
>>Smeagol: turned him into Gollum.
>
>
>I disagree completely. Frodo, IMO, was being offered _real_ power.
>
>The Ring offered Smeagol nothing. It needed to offer nothing; the lure of
>gold was sufficient to attract him and drive him to murder, and its minor
>ability to create invisibility enough to hold him firm. Frodo required more.
>
>The nature of magic in Middle Earth, combined with a general impression
>throughout the books, gives me to believe that the Ring could be forced to
>obey and grant power to a greater and greater degree, the greater your will.
>Thus, the stronger your will, the more that you could force the Ring to do.
>If you were strong enough, you could force the Ring to grant you its full
>power outright. It was this offer of _actual_ power, power great enough to
>defeat Sauron, force the Ring to do great things, and rule Middle Earth,
>that eventually corrupted Frodo.
>
>This knowledge is what gave it its influence even over people like Gandalf,
>who was powerfully tempted to take it up, yet in all the books dared touch
>it only for an instant, just once. He knew he could force the Ring to obey
>him by his will; it would grant _him_ power, no doubt about it, and he could
>make it do whatever he said. He could even use it to defeat Sauron and do
>great and wonderful things. However, once anyone gave in, they were trapped
>by the Ring; it would give them the power, but inevitably corrupt them. In
>the end, if it wasn't owned by Sauron, it might as well have been.
Your interpretation is of course, no less correct than mine, and possibly
moreso. Yet in a careful reading, I cannot find any indication that the Ring
would actually do the things it promised. It gave them dreams of glory
and then it enslaved them, as far as I can tell.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"It yearns me not if men my garments wear;
Such outward things dwell not in my desire:
But if it be a sin to covet honour,
I am the most offending soul alive."
William Shakespeare, Henry V
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott C. Nolan
nolan@erols.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 11:42:14 -0800
From: "Harvey, Michael" <michael.harvey@intel.com>
Subject: RE: Character: Frodo Baggins
>> I know hobbits were very good with missile weapons (including thrown
>> stones), but that may just have been from their high DEX.
>
> The "bonus with missiles" comes from Dungeons and Dragons.
> There is no reference to it in any of Tolkien's writings, I believe.
Actually Tolkien does mention that "hobbits are very accurate at throwing
stones, because it is a favorite activity of hobbit children" (rough
paraphrase) I think this was in the third book during the "scouring of the
shire" when Pippin or Merry picked up a stone and pegged someone with it.
(?) Anyway this is probably where D&D got the idea.
Mike
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 14:02:31 -0600 (CST)
From: "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
On Wed, 27 Jan 1999, Scott Nolan wrote:
> At 10:43 AM 1/27/99 -0500, you wrote:
> >>OBHero: IIRC, hobbits/halflings get a bonus with ranged combat/missile
> >>weapons. I don't remember any reference to this with Frodo.
> >
> >I know hobbits were very good with missile weapons (including thrown
> >stones), but that may just have been from their high DEX.
>
> The "bonus with missiles" comes from Dungeons and Dragons.
> There is no reference to it in any of Tolkien's writings, I believe.
Actually, having just come across it in _Fellowship of the Ring_, I can
say that it is there. In the edition I'm reading (which is at home or I'd
quote you edition, chapter and page) there is a sort-of prologue-y section
entitled (IIRC) "On Hobbits". In this section it makes reference to their
keen eyes and good coordination, especially with respect to missiles.
When I have a chance, I'll look up the exact reference.
J
Hostes aliengeni me abduxerent. Jeff Johnston - jeffj@io.com
Qui annus est? http://www.io.com/~jeffj
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 12:12:55 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: How much damage should guns do.
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
>Filksinger writes:
<snip>
>Hm...fascinating. So how exactly do you explain that the .44 magnum
(typical
>muzzle energy around 1400 joules) does dramatically more damage (2d6 w/+1
stun
>mod vs 2d-1 with a normal stun mod) than a .223 rifle (typical muzzle
energy
>around 1800 joules).
I can't. As best I remember, the .223 was the only weapon in the Hero Games
stats that _didn't_ match the Armory stats in DC.
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 13:53:40 -0600
From: "Guy Hoyle" <ghoyle1@airmail.net>
Subject: Character ideas needed: sci-fi hacker
I'm designing a character for a science fiction game (our "Mission:
Impossible" campaign), and have run into some stumbling blocks. The
setting is the 24th century; there are human colonies on Mars and the Moon,
and recently star travel has become possible; there are other life forms on
the planets of Alpha centauri and elsewhere. So far, all the planets get
along OK.
I'm trying to create a computer hack&crack specialist, and I've done OK in
that bdepartment. However, I haven't really got a feel for this character
yet. I want to give him some complementary and/or contrasting character
traits. I have no clue about his background or personality.
If anybody has any spare ideas they want to fling my way, I'd love to see
what you can come up with, no matter how vague; I just need something to
stimulate my imagination before 1/30, which is when we begin (yoiks!)
guy
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
"For every expert there is an equal and opposite expert."
- --Charles Fort
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 12:26:20 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
<snip>
>Your interpretation is of course, no less correct than mine, and possibly
>moreso. Yet in a careful reading, I cannot find any indication that the
Ring
>would actually do the things it promised. It gave them dreams of glory
>and then it enslaved them, as far as I can tell.
The problem, of course, being that only a tiny handful of people ever had
it, and not one ever used power beyond the invisibility, save for Sauron.
Sauron, who of course doesn't give us a clue as to what the Ring does for
others; Smeagol's friend, who died instantly; Smeagol, who had no will to
resist at all; Bilbo, who apparently was able to resist it pretty well, but
who was never offered power by it, never tried to destroy it, and mostly
ignored it; Gandalf, who threw it into a fire immediately, and strongly
desired it but resisted; Frodo, who was offered great power, Tom Bombadil,
to whom the Ring was nothing, and Samwise, who was offered power but
rejected it out of hand.
We know that many people with power strongly desired the Ring, even though
they hadn't seen it since Sauron last had it; Saruman(sp?), for example. We
know that at least one person who had no power but who traveled with Frodo
(Boromir) believed the Ring would give him power. However, we have no
evidence either way whether or not the Ring would actually give power to
_anyone_ except Sauron.
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: 27 Jan 1999 16:07:59 -0500
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: How much damage should guns do.
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"AJ" == Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com> writes:
AJ> Hm...fascinating. So how exactly do you explain that the .44 magnum
AJ> (typical muzzle energy around 1400 joules) does dramatically more
AJ> damage (2d6 w/+1 stun mod vs 2d-1 with a normal stun mod) than a .223
AJ> rifle (typical muzzle energy around 1800 joules).
Like I have stated about a hundred times already, .44 Magnum tends to dump
most of its energy into the target on impact, whereas .223 tends to retain
most of its energy on impact.
energy transfer
In other words, damage ~= ---------------
time
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- --
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ Warning: pregnant women, the elderly, and
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ children under 10 should avoid prolonged
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ exposure to Happy Fun Ball.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 13:43:17 -0600
From: "Daniel" <drake01@flash.net>
Subject: Re: Champs Web page
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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charset="iso-8859-1"
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Their page is down again
- -----Original Message-----
From: Raven <raven@neteze.com>
To: Champions Mail List <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Date: Wednesday, January 27, 1999 12:04 PM
Subject: Champs Web page
=20
=20
Is it just me or is there page down again?
- ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BE49FA.FE5FDEA0
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charset="iso-8859-1"
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 =
HTML//EN">
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.71.1712.3"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Their page is down =
again</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: =
5px">
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><B>-----Original =
Message-----</B><BR><B>From:=20
</B>Raven <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:raven@neteze.com">raven@neteze.com</A>><BR><B>To:=20
</B>Champions Mail List <<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:champ-l@sysabend.org">champ-l@sysabend.org</A>><BR><B>D=
ate:=20
</B>Wednesday, January 27, 1999 12:04 PM<BR><B>Subject: </B>Champs =
Web=20
page<BR><BR></DIV></FONT>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Is it just me or is there page =
down=20
again?</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
- ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BE49FA.FE5FDEA0--
------------------------------
Date: 27 Jan 1999 16:03:44 -0500
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: AP, Penetrating, Piercing
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Hash: SHA1
"JPH" == Jay P Hailey <jayphailey@juno.com> writes:
JPH> How does this work,as opposed to AP or Penetrating?
Piercing is quite simple, though I forget the actual costs. For each point
of Piercing you buy for a power, you can negate one point of the target's
defenses. Ie, if you buy 5 points of Piercing for your 2D6 RKA, you
automatically subtract 5 from the target's defenses. This works really
well for modern combat arms, which slice through light body armor (DEF 3-6)
with relative ease, without significantly affecting Infantry vehicle armor
(DEF 12-16) as Armor Piercing would.
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- --
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ Ingredients of Happy Fun Ball include an
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ unknown glowing substance which fell to
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ Earth, presumably from outer space.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 13:24:05 -0800 (PST)
From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
> The problem, of course, being that only a tiny handful of people
> ever had it, and not one ever used power beyond the invisibility,
> save for Sauron.
I thought that Sam and/or Frodo both used the Ring's awesome
PREsence bonuses to cow some Orks and escape the tower?
==
=========================== Elliott aka The Egyptoid ==
=== JLA: Justice League Alabama === Central HQ ===========
=== http://www.sysabend.org/champions/elliott/index.html =
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 13:10:56 -0800 (PST)
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
Subject: Re: How much damage should guns do.
Stainless Steel Rat writes:
> Like I have stated about a hundred times already, .44 Magnum tends to dump
> most of its energy into the target on impact, whereas .223 tends to retain
> most of its energy on impact.
> energy transfer
> In other words, damage ~= ---------------
> time
>
Um...this was in response to a post stating that damage appeared to be based
purely on kinetic energy. You're claiming it shouldn't be -- which is fine --
but rather unrelated to my point (which was that damage figures in hero4
_aren't_ based purely on kinetic energy).
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 13:50:09 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
>> The problem, of course, being that only a tiny handful of people
>> ever had it, and not one ever used power beyond the invisibility,
>> save for Sauron.
>I thought that Sam and/or Frodo both used the Ring's awesome
>PREsence bonuses to cow some Orks and escape the tower?
You got me there. OK, two powers.:)
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: 27 Jan 1999 16:21:11 -0500
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: No Conscious Control
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I think the GM was being unfair. No Conscious Control is a power
limitation, not a character disadvantage. The GM in question was treating
it as a disadvantage.
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- --
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ Caution: Happy Fun Ball may suddenly
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ accelerate to dangerous speeds.
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 13:44:10 -0800 (PST)
From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Character: Frodo Baggins
Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com> wrote:
>> unit of halflings in Arnor?
> No, Arthedain, actually. Arnor had fallen by that time.
Tomayto, Tomahto.
I knew it was one of the Old Northen Kingdoms :)
> trying to do here, which is recreate the characters seen
> in the Lord of the Rings. None of the hobbits seen there
> exhibit anything beyond a mere weapon familiarity.
Oh I agree. Giving any hobbits sling and archery plusses
is like saying "all American characterss get riflery plusses"
because of the skirmishes in the Revolutionary War.
Are you going to write-up the Watcher in the Water at
the Gates of Moria? ;[
How about the Alpha Warg? ;)
(from the pack of dire wolves that trapped them in the trees?)
==
=========================== Elliott aka The Egyptoid ==
=== JLA: Justice League Alabama === Central HQ ===========
=== http://www.sysabend.org/champions/elliott/index.html =
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 13:56:00 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Character ideas needed: sci-fi hacker
From: Guy Hoyle <ghoyle1@airmail.net>
<snip>
>I'm trying to create a computer hack&crack specialist, and I've done OK in
>that bdepartment. However, I haven't really got a feel for this character
>yet. I want to give him some complementary and/or contrasting character
>traits. I have no clue about his background or personality.
How about this? He _hates_ computers. He is an expert in hacking and
cracking because that allows him to _attack_ computers, not because he likes
the things. He is good with computers, but believes that they are replacing
humanity, and someday will turn us all into worthless drones, with
everything automated, everything done for us, and human beings outclassed in
all ways.
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 13:30:25 -0800
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Champs Web page
At 09:36 AM 1/27/99 -0800, Raven wrote:
>>>>
<excerpt><smaller>Is it just me or is there page down again?
</smaller>
</excerpt><<<<<<<<
It was down, but it's feeling much better now. :-]
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
------------------------------
Date: 27 Jan 1999 16:19:51 -0500
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: My thought on guns after your comments
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"F" == Filksinger <filkhero@usa.net> writes:
F> Not bad, but I wouldn't use it with _all_ rifles. Only the medium and
F> high powered ones using full-metal jacket ammo.
It also does not work. 5.56mm NATO *ignores* light body armor (DEF 3-6)
entirely, yet bounces off of light vehicle armor (DEF 12-16). See my
little description of Piercing that I just posted.
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- --
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ Caution: Happy Fun Ball may suddenly
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ accelerate to dangerous speeds.
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 13:21:46 PST
From: "Jesse Thomas" <haerandir@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Hobbit Missile Bonus
Well, yes and no. Bilbo is described in the Hobbit as being an expert
with thrown stones (cf. the fight with the giant spiders in Mirkwood).
I vaguely recall some reference early on in Fellowship to the effect
that Frodo carried on this tradition, but if so, it is in the first few
chapters, during the description of his boyhood, and doesn't come up
again in the rest of the Lord of the Rings. I certainly don't remember
Tolkien stating that this was true of all Hobbits.
Jesse Thomas
haerandir@hotmail.com
On Wed, 27 Jan 1999 Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com> wrote:
>
>The "bonus with missiles" comes from Dungeons and Dragons.
>There is no reference to it in any of Tolkien's writings, I believe.
>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>"It yearns me not if men my garments wear;
>Such outward things dwell not in my desire:
>But if it be a sin to covet honour,
>I am the most offending soul alive."
> William Shakespeare, Henry V
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>Scott C. Nolan
>nolan@erols.com
>
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 15:34:09 -0600 (CST)
From: "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com>
Subject: Re: Character ideas needed: sci-fi hacker
On Wed, 27 Jan 1999, Guy Hoyle wrote:
> I'm designing a character for a science fiction game (our "Mission:
> Impossible" campaign), and have run into some stumbling blocks.
>
> I'm trying to create a computer hack&crack specialist, and I've done OK in
> that bdepartment. However, I haven't really got a feel for this character
> yet. I want to give him some complementary and/or contrasting character
> traits. I have no clue about his background or personality.
Well, let me start off with a request: /please/ don't make him a
stereotypical geek. It's overdone. But you knew that, I just wanted to
get it off of my chest.
Here's an idea:
The Rebel: he got into hacking & cracking because he likes to break the
rules, and that shows up in the rest of his life, too. Expect him to
challenge rules and authority whenever possible. Play him as the hacker
equivalent of the classic 'loose cannon' characters from cop films.
Probably wears a leather jacket and drives the 24th century equivalent of
a Harley.
J
Hostes aliengeni me abduxerent. Jeff Johnston - jeffj@io.com
Qui annus est? http://www.io.com/~jeffj
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 18:13:14 -0500
From: Scott Nolan <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Tolkien Characters (was: Frodo Baggins)
>Are you going to write-up the Watcher in the Water at
>the Gates of Moria? ;[
>
>How about the Alpha Warg? ;)
Here is a list of the characters I have done and intend to do:
Aragorn
Arwen
Balrog
Barrow-Wight
Bilbo Baggins
Boromir
Celeborn
Denethor
Elrond
Eomer
Eowyn
Faramir
Frodo Baggins
Galadriel
Gandalf
Ghan-buri-Ghan
Gildor Inglorien
Gimili
Gollum
Grima Wormtongue
Gwaihir
Imrahil
Lord of the Nazgul
Merry Brandybuck
Oathbreakers
Old Man Willow
One Ring
Pippin Took
Radagast
Sam Gamgee
Saruman
Sauron
Shadowfax
Shelob
Theoden
Tom Bombadil
Treebeard
Trolls
Uruk-hai, typical
Watcher in the Water
I've 14 of the 40 so far. As you can see, I'll be revisiting the One Ring,
and all will be revisited in light of list comments when I post them to my
site.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"It yearns me not if men my garments wear;
Such outward things dwell not in my desire:
But if it be a sin to covet honour,
I am the most offending soul alive."
William Shakespeare, Henry V
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott C. Nolan
nolan@erols.com
------------------------------
End of champ-l-digest V1 #165
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Date: Monday, May 24, 1999 03:15 PM