Digest Archive vol 1 Issue 379

From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Sent: Monday, June 07, 1999 4:39 PM
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #379


champ-l-digest Monday, June 7 1999 Volume 01 : Number 379



In this issue:

Re: Instant Change
Re: AoE EGO Blast
Re: Hexless Combat
Races and Average Characters
RE: OT Email 10 Commandments
Re: Races and Average Characters
RE: OT Email 10 Commandments
Re: Swapping stats
Re: AoE EGO Blast
Re: AoE EGO Blast
Re: Control Pain
Re: Races and Average Characters
Re: AoE EGO Blast
Re: Swapping stats
Re: Races and Average Characters
Re: Races and Average Characters
Re: AoE EGO Blast
The Flockhearder's Crook (Magic Item for Fantasy HERO)
Re: Swapping stats
Re: Instant Change
Earthquakes?
Re: Earthquakes?
Hero's Web Page?
Re: Earthquakes?
Re: Earthquakes?
Re: Earthquakes?
Re: Earthquakes?
Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)
Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)
Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)
Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)
Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)
Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)
Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)
Re: Earthquakes?

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 07 Jun 1999 09:17:23 -0400
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: Instant Change

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* "Filksinger" <filkhero@deskmail.com> on Mon, 07 Jun 1999
| So, unless you are attempting "Instant Change, UAO", there is no
| reason why Transformation on your own clothes cannot be 0 phase,
| unless your GM believes changing clothes is an attack.

Just the one specific rule in the book that states that you cannot use
Transformation on yourself. I would say that your own clothes -- your
superhero outfit -- qualfiies. You cannot use Transformation on your
business suit to turn it into a suit of armor. You want Armor, you buy
Armor, then your Instant Change can have "transformation" as a special
effect as it turns your power suit into power armor :).
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- --
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball.
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 09:29:08 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: AoE EGO Blast

On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Bob Greenwade wrote:

> >> How would an AoE: One Hex EGO Blast function?
> >
> >You would roll against the ECV of the hex (3, of course), whereupon
> >whomever was in the hex would be hit. Best against egoists, not so
> >good against martial artists and others who can dive for cover well.
>
> I wouldn't think that a hex would *have* an ECV....

That is my opinion as well.

- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html

"It doesn't have to be like this. All we need to do is
make sure we keep talking."
Dr. Stephen Hawking, in Pink Floyd's "Keep Talking"

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 06:56:47 PDT
From: S A Rudy <sarudy@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Hexless Combat

Bob Greenwade writes
>At 05:43 PM 6/6/1999 -0700, Filksinger wrote:
>>Home Depot also carries those large flat wall tiles to do bathtub
>>walls/showers in, giving a smooth surface that is immune to almost
>>anything. You could even glue them to a sheet of metal.

> Hey, cool! Now we can play Champions while showering! ;-]

You know, between this and the "how fast I can strip all my
clothes off" discussion in the Instant Change thread, I'm
getting some very disturbing mental images, here.

- -S

- --
|Now you, too can say "I've been to Hellenback!" Just drop by
|http://www.eclipse.net/~srudy/hellenback/index.html


_______________________________________________________________
Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 08:58:50 -0500
From: redbf@ldd.net (bobby farris)
Subject: Races and Average Characters

I have a question (No surprise). My question is how do I determine a
"racial average." For example I want to create a race called Herogamers.
I have decided that the average Herogamer is more intelliegent then the
average human, and has a higher Character Maxima INT.

I give them Increased Character Maxima INT 25, and EGO 23. Also I give
them Decreased Character Maxima STR 17.

Now, the average human has Stats of 10. All characters would still start
with stats of 10. I figure this is too keep the character's in balance
with each other. However, I want to know what is the average EGO for an
average Herogamer? Is it A) or B).

A) If the average EGO for a Herogamer is still 10, then how do I
make the average Herogamer have a higher average EGO? Do I have to buy
EGO +3 as part of the Racial package along with the Increased Character
Maxima?

B)Or, is it assumed that Races with higher Character Maxima have
higher Racial Averages (because they spend points)? For instance, since
our Herogamer has bought Increased Character Maxima INT 25 it is assumed
that their average INT is 15. So when a person wants to play a Herogamer
and starts writing up their character they have to buy atleast 5 points
worth of INT to be an average Herogamer.

I actually think either way is about the same, it is just where the
points come from. I would like to get your opinions on what the
"Official" line is. The only thing I can figure out is that it seems
that A) is more flexible than B). Also it seems that if we assume the
average of every race is a 0 point character (yes, I know that
technically Hero is wrong in this) then where do the disadvantage points
come from when the Herogamer has to buy his extra INT.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 06:59:46 -0700
From: Grant Enfield <enfield@asu.edu>
Subject: RE: OT Email 10 Commandments

> Thou shalt include a clear and specific subject line.

Forgive me, Father, for I have sinned. . . . :)




grant

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 10:11:34 -0400
From: Geoff Speare <geoff@igcn.com>
Subject: Re: Races and Average Characters

If you want the official line, skip this message. :)

I do not use the Increased/Decreased Maxima rules, because they make all
characters of that race pay for a potential stat which may never get used.
If you play a "strong" race and don't buy your STR to the max, you are
wasting points. Instead, I keep the costs the same for every race, and just
grant blanket permission for certain races to go above (or below) the human
maxima.

> A) If the average EGO for a Herogamer is still 10, then how do I
>make the average Herogamer have a higher average EGO? Do I have to buy
>EGO +3 as part of the Racial package along with the Increased Character
>Maxima?

Skip the racial package, just require any player who wants to be that race
to buy a higher EGO. If they insist on having a 10, remind them several
times that they are "weak willed", and make sure that NPCs in the game
react appropriately (I'm not sure how you tease someone for having a low
EGO, but I'm sure it can be done :).

>Also it seems that if we assume the
>average of every race is a 0 point character (yes, I know that
>technically Hero is wrong in this) then where do the disadvantage points
>come from when the Herogamer has to buy his extra INT.

I would disagree that this is the case; some fantasy races are "better"
than humans, and should cost points. Tolkien elves, for example, are
certainly not 0 points!

Geoff Speare

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 10:07:43 -0400
From: Brian Wawrow <bwawrow@fmco.com>
Subject: RE: OT Email 10 Commandments

I heard there were some lost parchments found under the mouse-clicking paw
of the sphinx. Among other things, the ancient Egyptians [on strict advice
from their Atlantean overlords] followed the following rule above all
others.

Thou shalt not reply to thine mailing list unless thou canst contribute that
which is useful to the conversation. Yaaaaay... Pharaoh!

BRI

] This appeared in a locoal computer magazine and struck me as relevant.
]
] Thou shalt include a clear and specific subject line.
] Thou shalt edit any quoted text down to the minimum thou needest.
] Thou shalt read thine own message thrice before thou sendest.
] Thou shalt ponder how thy recipient might react to thy message.
] Thou shalt check thy spelling and grammar.
] Thou shalt not curse, flame, spam, or USE ALL CAPS.
] Thou shalt not forward any chain letter.
] Thou shalt not rely on the privacy of email, especially from work.
] Thou shalt not use e-mail for any illegal or unethical purpose.
] Thou shalt when in doubt, save thy message overnight and
] reread it in the
] light of the dawn.
] And the Golden Rule of e-mail: That which thou findest
] hateful to recieve,
] sendest thou not unto others.
]
]
] ============================
] Geoff Heald
] ============================
] Attention all enemies of the Rival Ninja Corporation: You
] will lay down
] your weapons and surrender to your nearest R.N.C.
] representative. Failure
] to do so will result in your total destruction. Thank you.
]
]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 22:32:18 +0800
From: GAZZA <gazza@wantree.com.au>
Subject: Re: Swapping stats

Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
>
> * GAZZA <gazza@wantree.com.au> on Mon, 07 Jun 1999
> | Just because it says "opponent"? So you can't Drain yourself either?
>
> Exactly.

How pedantic do we get here? Can I Transfer or Drain one of my
Duplicates? A Follower? My DNPC? My teammates?

> | I admit that Transferring yourself isn't a very USEFUL thing to do,
> | but I don't see why it should be disallowed.
>
> Because it duplicates the effect of Multipower.

How?

> | Most of the suggestions - Drain Side Effect on an Aid, for example
> | - are a Transfer in all but name.
>
> No, it is not, and if you think about it you will see just how
> differently the two constructs actually work.

In what way, exactly? The effect - gain one stat, lose another - is the
same. With the right limitation value, it would cost the same, too.

> They are similar, but they are not the same.

Not literally identical, in the sense that (eg) the Active Points of
the Aid-With-Drain-Side-Effect would be a lot lower. But I personally
wouldn't stop someone Draining/Transferring themselves anymore than
I would say that they can't Energy Blast themselves.

Reading too much into the word "opponent" could result in Drain not
being a legal Side Effect power, for example.
- --
GAZZA
"To know others is wisdom.
To know one's self is enlightenment."

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 22:33:48 +0800
From: GAZZA <gazza@wantree.com.au>
Subject: Re: AoE EGO Blast

Michael Surbrook wrote:
>
> On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Bob Greenwade wrote:
> >
> > I wouldn't think that a hex would *have* an ECV....
>
> That is my opinion as well.

The Ultimate Mentalist rules that the ECV of a hex is 3, presumably
for the purpose of resolving Area Effect mental powers. Frankly,
though, I'm inclined to agree that Non-Selective or Selective makes
more sense.
- --
GAZZA
"To know others is wisdom.
To know one's self is enlightenment."

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 09:38:38 -0500
From: "Guy Hoyle" <ghoyle1@airmail.net>
Subject: Re: AoE EGO Blast

On 6/7/99 at 10:33 PM GAZZA wrote:

>Michael Surbrook wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Bob Greenwade wrote:
>> >
>> > I wouldn't think that a hex would *have* an ECV....
>>
>> That is my opinion as well.
>
>The Ultimate Mentalist rules that the ECV of a hex is 3, presumably
>for the purpose of resolving Area Effect mental powers. Frankly,
>though, I'm inclined to agree that Non-Selective or Selective makes
>more sense.

What if you're trying to affect a city block? A small town? An entire city?=
The sheer number of rolls involved would be enormous.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 10:33:54 EDT
From: Leah L Watts <llwatts@juno.com>
Subject: Re: Control Pain

>One of the Jedi powers is to "Control Pain." This allows the Jedi to
>ignore all penalties from getting wounded. They can be wounded, even
>knocked unconscious with this power up, but they won't "feel it." In
>game terms they don't take any penalties for their wounds.
>
>I am writing it up as Cannot be Stunned, Plus the power ****
>The problem I am having is the **** I know what it is, I just don't know
>how much it should cost. I am going to be using the Impairment/Disabling
>rules along with the rules that state a character can only attack after
>being wounded by making an EGO roll -1 per 2 BODY taken.

If you have/can borrow a copy of Dark Champions, there's a couple
different ways to model this in there. I'm not too sure about using
Cannot be Stunned; I'd have to rewatch Return of the Jedi to be certain,
but I think there were a couple scenes on the Emperor's ship where Luke
and Darth looked pretty groggy.

Leah

___________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 22:39:40 +0800
From: GAZZA <gazza@wantree.com.au>
Subject: Re: Races and Average Characters

Geoff Speare wrote:
>
> If you want the official line, skip this message. :)

And this one.

> I do not use the Increased/Decreased Maxima rules, because they make all
> characters of that race pay for a potential stat which may never get
> used.
> If you play a "strong" race and don't buy your STR to the max, you are
> wasting points. Instead, I keep the costs the same for every race, and
> just grant blanket permission for certain races to go above (or below)
> the human maxima.

I agree with you about the Increased/Decreased Maxima being not worth
the points.

Instead, my racial packages "buy" (or "sell") the increased/decreased
points directly. That is, I rate "increased average" rather than
"increased maximum".

For example, I might say that Elves have an average INT 15, DEX 13,
CON 8, PRE 13. This means that Elves pay 19 points for their package
(excluding anything else that it contains), and can then proceed to
increase or decrease their characteristics further. For example, they
can have an INT of 13 and get "back" 2 points.

They still pay normal costs for exceeding 20 in INT, DEX, and PRE,
but they are more likely to do this because they get the first few
points "free".

(snip!)
- --
GAZZA
"To know others is wisdom.
To know one's self is enlightenment."

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 22:41:23 +0800
From: GAZZA <gazza@wantree.com.au>
Subject: Re: AoE EGO Blast

Guy Hoyle wrote:

> >The Ultimate Mentalist rules that the ECV of a hex is 3, presumably
> >for the purpose of resolving Area Effect mental powers. Frankly,
> >though, I'm inclined to agree that Non-Selective or Selective makes
> >more sense.
>
> What if you're trying to affect a city block? A small town? An entire
> city? The sheer number of rolls involved would be enormous.

Not really. Just make one roll, and apply it to all targets. Wouldn't
you do that anyway at some point, or would you roll the damage for
an AE Ego Attack against each individual target in the city? ;-)
- --
GAZZA
"To know others is wisdom.
To know one's self is enlightenment."

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 09:39:48 -0500
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net>
Subject: Re: Swapping stats

At 09:12 AM 6/7/1999 -0400, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
>| I admit that Transferring yourself isn't a very USEFUL thing to do,
>| but I don't see why it should be disallowed.
>
>Because it duplicates the effect of Multipower.

So? I know you aren't, as a rule, supposed to use one Power to duplicate
the effects of another -- though I can't actually find that reference,
except in connection with Change Environment -- but Multipower isn't a
Power, so what's the problem?

True, a player shouldn't seek to circumvent the cost or standard
restrictions of a Power by using a hacked construct to build a "new" Power
that duplicates the effects of an existing one. However, the idea that
there is only one legal route from Concept A to Construct B kind of flies
in the faces of Hero's vaunted flexibility. If an alternate construct fits
the character concept or SFX better than the standard construct, and is not
grossly abusive by being a lot cheaper or less restrictive in its use, it
*should* be allowed.

Damon

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 10:46:30 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jason Sullivan <ravanos@NJCU.edu>
Subject: Re: Races and Average Characters

On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, bobby farris wrote:
> I have a question (No surprise). My question is how do I determine a
> "racial average." For example I want to create a race called Herogamers.
> I have decided that the average Herogamer is more intelliegent then the
> average human, and has a higher Character Maxima INT.
<snip>
> A) If the average EGO for a Herogamer is still 10, then how do I
> make the average Herogamer have a higher average EGO? Do I have to buy
> EGO +3 as part of the Racial package along with the Increased Character
> Maxima?
> B)Or, is it assumed that Races with higher Character Maxima have
> higher Racial Averages (because they spend points)? For instance, since
> our Herogamer has bought Increased Character Maxima INT 25 it is assumed
> that their average INT is 15. So when a person wants to play a Herogamer
> and starts writing up their character they have to buy atleast 5 points
> worth of INT to be an average Herogamer.

In a Heroic game where Normal Characteristic Maxima is standard,
Racial Packages and their adjustments for said Maxima are viable.
While no "baseline" adjustment is listed for the Racial Package,
in Fantasy HERO it is suggested that the statistic that "falls short" of
the modified maxium is considered under the average racial maxium. (Ex:
Dwarves have a maxium COM of 23. 13 is considered "average" for the
race).

In a Superheroic game where there is no game-standard NCM
required, Racial packages and their Adjustments have no effect unless the
character takes NCM.
If a player character of mine in a Superheroic game wanted tp play
Fantasy Elf or a Gweenie, I (personally) would suggest that they use the
Racial Package as a guideline and build as per normal rules.

As far as Racial Packages having a "baseline" adjustment to
statistics... they only modify the limits of an NCM, all though I have
seen Racial Packages written up with "adjustments" and point values listed
within them (which, IMHO, should _not_ be considered when calculating a
package bonus).
I, personally, offer a "modifier package" for each race to make
calculation easier.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 07:56:21 -0700
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Races and Average Characters

At 08:58 AM 6/7/1999 -0500, bobby farris wrote:
>I have a question (No surprise). My question is how do I determine a
>"racial average." For example I want to create a race called Herogamers.
>I have decided that the average Herogamer is more intelliegent then the
>average human, and has a higher Character Maxima INT.
>
>I give them Increased Character Maxima INT 25, and EGO 23. Also I give
>them Decreased Character Maxima STR 17.
>
>Now, the average human has Stats of 10. All characters would still start
>with stats of 10. I figure this is too keep the character's in balance
>with each other. However, I want to know what is the average EGO for an
>average Herogamer? Is it A) or B).

The *average* INT, EGO and anything else for a particular race is
whatever you, as GM (or as creator of the race, at any rate), say it is.
Herogamers will still start with a base of 10 for purposes of character
creation, whether you declare the average is 10 or 15 or something in
between or beyond those points (yes, Herogamers could have a Maximum INT of
25, but an average of 5).
The *usual* case is to have a racial average of 10 less than the maximum
(in this case, INT 15, EGO 13, and STR 7), but there's no rule about this
because it's a campaign thing that doesn't really affect the balance of
play.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
Interested in sarrusophones? Join the Sarrusophone Mailing List!
http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/Sarrusophone

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 07:49:59 -0700
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: AoE EGO Blast

At 09:38 AM 6/7/1999 -0500, Guy Hoyle wrote:
>
>What if you're trying to affect a city block? A small town? An entire
city? The sheer number of rolls involved would be enormous.

When it gets to that point, I'd recommend just rolling once and using
that one Attack Roll for all targets (whether the Power is based on DEX or
EGO).
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
Interested in sarrusophones? Join the Sarrusophone Mailing List!
http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/Sarrusophone

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 11:04:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jason Sullivan <ravanos@NJCU.edu>
Subject: The Flockhearder's Crook (Magic Item for Fantasy HERO)

Here are some possible constructs.

Initially, I wanted to make an "easy to hit" power which would do
some form of damage to non-living matter and an attack that would STUN.

If anyone has any suggestions, they would be greatly appreciated.

11 3d6 STUN Only EB, AoE: 1 Hex (+1/2), AVLD: Power Defense, Indirect
(+1/4), No Range Penalty (+1/2); Burnout 14- (-1/4), OAF (-1), Independent
(-2), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), 1 Recoverable Charge (-1 1/4)

and/or

17 2d6 EB, AoE: 1 Hex (+1/2), NND: Only functions versus non-living
matter; Will not work against living creatures (+1), Does BODY (+1),
Indirect (+1/4), No Range Penalty (+1/2); Burnout 14- (-1/4), OAF (-1),
Independent (-2), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), 1 Recoverable
Charge (-1 1/4)

and/or

10 6d6 EGO Blast, Works vs. Power Defense instead of Mental Defense
(0); Burnout 14- (-1/4), OAF (-1), Independent (-2), Gestures (-1/4),
Incantations (-1/4), 1 Recoverable Charge (-1 1/4)

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 09:26:47 -0700
From: "James Jandebeur" <james@javaman.to>
Subject: Re: Swapping stats

> I admit that Transferring yourself isn't a very USEFUL thing to do,
> but I don't see why it should be disallowed. Most of the suggestions -
> Drain Side Effect on an Aid, for example - are a Transfer in all but
> name.

On the other hand, though, having a Drain Side Effect on an Aid is cheaper,
which is appropriate considering how much less useful it is.

JAJ, GP

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 09:37:50 -0700
From: "James Jandebeur" <james@javaman.to>
Subject: Re: Instant Change

> Just the one specific rule in the book that states that you cannot use
> Transformation on yourself. I would say that your own clothes -- your
> superhero outfit -- qualfiies. You cannot use Transformation on your
> business suit to turn it into a suit of armor. You want Armor, you buy
> Armor, then your Instant Change can have "transformation" as a special
> effect as it turns your power suit into power armor :).

Well, since we were discussing what the 5th Edition says on the subject
(from what little we know), and since Instant Change is by some means being
rolled into Transform, from what we have been told by the writer, I'm not
sure that siting the 4th Edition has validity. No one to my knowledge
brought up the possibility of using it to create suits of power armor,
either, at least without paying for it.

Oh, well.

JAJ, GP

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 14:53:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Earthquakes?

So...

how would you define an earthquake in Hero terms? I havea creature that
can create such things, and I'm trying to decide between TK or Energy
Blast.

Any other ideas?

- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html

"It doesn't have to be like this. All we need to do is
make sure we keep talking."
Dr. Stephen Hawking, in Pink Floyd's "Keep Talking"

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 14:58:06 -0400
From: "Chris Hartjes" <chartjes@littlehart.net>
Subject: Re: Earthquakes?

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
To: Champions Mailing List <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Sent: Monday, June 07, 1999 2:53 PM
Subject: Earthquakes?


> So...
>
> how would you define an earthquake in Hero terms? I havea creature that
> can create such things, and I'm trying to decide between TK or Energy
> Blast.
>
> Any other ideas?

I have used EB to simulate earthquakes, with the limitation "only effects objects
touch the ground". Seemed logical to me.

Chris Hartjes

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 12:18:46 -0700
From: "Raven" <raven@neteze.com>
Subject: Hero's Web Page?

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- ------=_NextPart_000_0097_01BEB0DF.E3F914E0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hello all

Any word as to when there web page will be back up?

- ------=_NextPart_000_0097_01BEB0DF.E3F914E0
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2614.3401" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hello all</FONT></DIV>
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Any word as to when there web page will =
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Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 15:13:08 EDT
From: AndMat3@aol.com
Subject: Re: Earthquakes?

In a message dated 6/7/99 2:53:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
susano@dedaana.otd.com writes:

> how would you define an earthquake in Hero terms? I havea creature that
> can create such things, and I'm trying to decide between TK or Energy
> Blast.
>
> Any other ideas?

I find that describing environmental effects with only one power is really
hard... TK for some stuff (falling debris, being thrown about)... but what
about gas lines that break (energy blast or ka); maybe it should just be
TRANSFORM - City that was standing to city that is not standing. :)

It should also have a killing attack component... to take out power stations,
destroy damns and buildings. In fact, maybe a killing attack should be the
primary power... it's much easier to break a building with KA than with TK.

later,

andy

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 14:22:48 -0500 (CDT)
From: Curt Hicks <exucurt@exu.ericsson.se>
Subject: Re: Earthquakes?

> From: "Chris Hartjes" <chartjes@littlehart.net>
>
> From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
>
> > So...
> >
> > how would you define an earthquake in Hero terms? I havea creature that
> > can create such things, and I'm trying to decide between TK or Energy
> > Blast.
> >
> > Any other ideas?
>
> I have used EB to simulate earthquakes, with the limitation "only effects objects
> touch the ground". Seemed logical to me.
>

But earthquakes don't do damage to everything touching the ground right ?
Just large rigid objects that are 'fastened' to the ground....

How about autofire area-of-effect TK to represent the shaking / tossing around ?

Curt

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 14:28:54 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com>
Subject: Re: Earthquakes?

On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Michael Surbrook wrote:

> So...
>
> how would you define an earthquake in Hero terms? I havea creature that
> can create such things, and I'm trying to decide between TK or Energy
> Blast.

Lessee...I'm assuming you want it to do the following:

1) Knock down buildings.
2) Knock people off their feet.

Do you want it to be a continuing effect, also, or just a short, sharp,
shock?

For 1 & 2, I would suggest the following:

1) RKA, Explosion or AE: Radius, only vs. things attached to the ground
(-1 1/2 probably)
2) EB, Explosion or AE: Radius, only does knockdown (-1? more?
Knock*back* only is -3/4, right?), only vs.
things on the ground but not attached to it (-1?)

Season those with 'Continuous' and 'Reduced END' as appropriate for a
continuing earthquake. L*nked would be appropriate as well.

You might also want to do the following:

3) Drain vs. Dex, Explosion/AE: Radius, Drained points return immediately
when AE is left or Continuous attck is turned off (-1/2), not vs.
things not on the ground (-1/4)

That represents the penalties that everyone would have to fight, pick
locks, drive, walk tightropes, etc when the Earth is shaking.

J

Hostes aliengeni me abduxerent. Jeff Johnston - jeffj@io.com
Qui annus est? http://www.io.com/~jeffj

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 15:50:34 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jason Sullivan <ravanos@NJCU.edu>
Subject: Re: Earthquakes?

On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Michael Surbrook wrote:
> So...
> how would you define an earthquake in Hero terms? I have a creature that
> can create such things, and I'm trying to decide between TK or Energy
> Blast.
> Any other ideas?

I had three powers in a construct for Tammy "Tantrum" Meyers:

Indirect AoE EB
Indirect AoE TK
with a Triggered Entangle (X amount of BODY) and RKA for falling
debris and cracks in the earth opening up and sucking people in.

The powers had the limitation: Only to simulate the effects of an
earthquake.

I based these powers, loosely, after the Assassinino Montena.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 15:57:14 -0400
From: "Johnson, Adam" <AJohnson@clariion.com>
Subject: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)

On a related note... how would one model a high-gravitational field?

Here's the reason. Our GM on this past Saturday threw one of these at us. He based it on an AoE TK STR 30. (This was scaled down since the original TK STR 80 was like 240 Active after putting in the enhancements.)
Later on, I had thought that an Entangle with the SFX "gravity" would work just as well.

Any other ideas?


- ----------------------------------------------------------
Adam Johnson
Product Support -- Head Lab Resident Area Tech (LabRAT)
ajohnson@clariion.com
- ----------------------------------------------------------


- -----Original Message-----
From: Jason Sullivan [mailto:ravanos@NJCU.edu]
Sent: Monday, 07 June, 1999 15:51
To: Michael Surbrook
Cc: champ-l@sysabend.org
Subject: Re: Earthquakes?


On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Michael Surbrook wrote:
> So...
> how would you define an earthquake in Hero terms? I have a creature that
> can create such things, and I'm trying to decide between TK or Energy
> Blast.
> Any other ideas?

I had three powers in a construct for Tammy "Tantrum" Meyers:

Indirect AoE EB
Indirect AoE TK
with a Triggered Entangle (X amount of BODY) and RKA for falling
debris and cracks in the earth opening up and sucking people in.

The powers had the limitation: Only to simulate the effects of an
earthquake.

I based these powers, loosely, after the Assassinino Montena.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 16:01:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)

On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Johnson, Adam wrote:

>
> On a related note... how would one model a high-gravitational field?
>
> Here's the reason. Our GM on this past Saturday threw one of these at us. He based it on an AoE TK STR 30. (This was scaled down since the original TK STR 80 was like 240 Active after putting in the enhancements.)
> Later on, I had thought that an Entangle with the SFX "gravity" would work just as well.
>
> Any other ideas?

Here's what I did:

100 Control Local Gravity: TK: 45 STR, Invisible to Sight (+1/2),
Indirect (+1/2), 0 END (+1/2), Persistent (+1/2), Affects all
parts of target (-1/4), Only to pull down, push up (-1/2), Loses
effect over time (-1/4)
77 Rapid Gravity Increase: EB: 9d6 Physical, Penetrating (+1/2),
Invisible to Sight (+1/2), Indirect (+1/2), 0 END (+1/2), Linked
to TK (-1/2), No KB (-1/4)
77 Severe Gravity Increase: HKA: 3d6, Penetrating (+1/2),
Invisible to Sight (+1/2), Indirect (+1/2), 0 END (+1/2), Linked
to TK (-1/2), No KB (-1/4)
43 Increased Body Mass: Hand Attack: 9d6, Invisible to Sight (+1/2),
0 END (+1/2), No KB (-1/4)
14 Decreased Gravity: Flight: 5", Usable against others (+1),
Ranged (+1/2), 0 END (+1/2), Persistent (+1/2), No noncombat
flight (-1/4), Only to negate gravity (-1), Loses effect over
time (-1/4)
34 Visualize Local Gravity: Detect: Gravity Waves, Ranged, Sense,
Targeting 14-

- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html

"It doesn't have to be like this. All we need to do is
make sure we keep talking."
Dr. Stephen Hawking, in Pink Floyd's "Keep Talking"

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 13:03:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Steven J. Owens" <puff@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)

Johnson, Adam writes:

> On a related note... how would one model a high-gravitational field?
>
> Here's the reason. Our GM on this past Saturday threw one of these
> at us. He based it on an AoE TK STR 30. (This was scaled down since
> the original TK STR 80 was like 240 Active after putting in the
> enhancements.) Later on, I had thought that an Entangle with the
> SFX "gravity" would work just as well.

I've tried to build such a beastie myself in the past. I think I
ended up going with an AoE Radius, Continuous, Uncontrolled Telekinesis.

For "environmental" high gravity (as opposed to a superpower) I
suppose that applying some of the mechanics of entangle & breakout
rolls might make sense, but I'd just define as a constant level of N
body of entangle, transparent, etc. If I was going to try to build it
as a power (I don't think I would) it'd need some sort of area effect,
continuous, uncontrollable, transparent, non-cumulative combination of
advantages and limitations.

Steven J. Owens
puff@netcom.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 16:06:40 -0400
From: "Scott C. Nolan" <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)

At 03:57 PM 6/7/99 -0400, you wrote:
>
>On a related note... how would one model a high-gravitational field?
>
>Here's the reason. Our GM on this past Saturday threw one of these at us. He
>based it on an AoE TK STR 30. (This was scaled down since the original TK
>STR 80 was like 240 Active after putting in the enhancements.)
>Later on, I had thought that an Entangle with the SFX "gravity" would work
>just as well.
>
>Any other ideas?

TK works better for this. You can't break out of Gravity.

30 STR TK, Area of Effect, radius (+1), 1 hour continuing charge (-1/2),
affects all parts (-1/4), only to simulate gravity (-1/2),
Obvious, Inaccessible Focus (-1/2) : 90 Active Points, 33 real points.

OR

30 STR TK, Area of Effect, radius (+1), continuous (+1), uncontrolled (+1/2),
affects all parts (-1/4), only to simulate gravity (-1/2),
Obvious, Inaccessible Focus (-1/2) : 157 Active Points, 70 real points.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 15:19:44 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com>
Subject: Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)

On Mon, 7 Jun 1999, Scott C. Nolan wrote:

> TK works better for this. You can't break out of Gravity.
>
> 30 STR TK, Area of Effect, radius (+1), 1 hour continuing charge (-1/2),
> affects all parts (-1/4), only to simulate gravity (-1/2),
> Obvious, Inaccessible Focus (-1/2) : 90 Active Points, 33 real points.

Why OIF?

J

Hostes aliengeni me abduxerent. Jeff Johnston - jeffj@io.com
Qui annus est? http://www.io.com/~jeffj

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 7 Jun 1999 13:14:35 -0700
From: "James Jandebeur" <james@javaman.to>
Subject: Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)

> On a related note... how would one model a high-gravitational field?

I actually modeled it off of Density Increase, Usable against Others, but
with no stat increase. That made the target heavier (technically it made
them more massive, but I fudged that a bit), and I judged that they would
need to carry the extra load. There are still some problems (technically,
again, this doesn't increase their falling acceleration, just their terminal
velocity: again, some fudging required).

Another way was Flight, UAO, Ranged, down only, and so on. If you buy enough
Flight and Non-Combat Multiples to allow you to get the same acceleration as
gravity, you have sort of made gravity, but again have to fudge on things
like the target having actual weight, the target being able to lift the same
amount, and so on.

Telekinesis is really going to end up being the power of choice for most
gravitational manipulation effects. Yes, it can be broken out of, which is
not really reasonable. No matter what you do, there is going to be fudging
involved to get it right.

JAJ, Gaming Philosopher
http://www.javaman.to/metapowers.html

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 13:35:48 -0700
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Gravity of the situation (was: RE: Earthquakes?)

At 03:57 PM 6/7/1999 -0400, Johnson, Adam wrote:
>
>On a related note... how would one model a high-gravitational field?
>
>Here's the reason. Our GM on this past Saturday threw one of these at us.
He based it on an AoE TK STR 30. (This was scaled down since the original
TK STR 80 was like 240 Active after putting in the enhancements.)
>Later on, I had thought that an Entangle with the SFX "gravity" would work
just as well.
>
>Any other ideas?

Under Hero4, I've tended to use AoE Aid for this, treating it as though
it's Aiding STR (IOW +5 pips means double gravity). Most other folks on
the list don't like that idea, but I've found it works.
OTOH, again, I think I've read somewhere that expansions on CE will
specifically enable gravity control in Hero5.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
Interested in sarrusophones? Join the Sarrusophone Mailing List!
http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/Sarrusophone

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 13:32:24 -0700
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Earthquakes?

At 02:53 PM 6/7/1999 -0400, Michael Surbrook wrote:
>So...
>
>how would you define an earthquake in Hero terms? I havea creature that
>can create such things, and I'm trying to decide between TK or Energy
>Blast.
>
>Any other ideas?

If you're looking for a Power that causes an earthquake, I personally
would be torn between TK and Change Environment. I think Hero5 upgrades to
CE would make that the more appropriate Power, but under Hero4 a big AE TK
(with appropriate Limitations) would probably be the best model.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
Interested in sarrusophones? Join the Sarrusophone Mailing List!
http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/Sarrusophone

------------------------------

End of champ-l-digest V1 #379
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